Why should I join BCS?

[Kelvin Tan]

Hi ppl,

this is perhaps a question on many hobbyist minds....and we should try and find out the reasons why ppl dun join.

actually i think i know some of the reasons which ppl dun wanna join....but i probably get bombed if i mention it and find myself facing many enemies. but for the good of the club....let me do something first to prove my point (when i am free) then in the meanwhile, have a discussion....

So any idea on how to make them join?

[Samuel Phan]

Hi Kelvin,

I admire your courage ... this has always been a question that pple in the committe often ask ourselves ... that is the reason why the committe have been working so hard to get the club going.

There might have been some areas that we have over-looked and some areas where our hands are tied ... due to multiple factors like man-power, fundings, timings etc.

But still ... any comments is appreciated.

In this forum ... there is no flaming ...just sensible talks.

PS: If you think that your suggestion can make a real difference and willing to play a part in the committee ... do drop us a mail. We will be more than happy to receive you with open arms.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Samuel Phan]

Hi Kelvin,

I admire your courage ... this has always been a question that pple in the committe often ask ourselves ... that is the reason why the committe have been working so hard to get the club going.

There might have been some areas that we have over-looked and some areas where our hands are tied ... due to multiple factors like man-power, fundings, timings etc.

But still ... any comments is appreciated.

In this forum ... there is no flaming ...just sensible talks.

PS: If you think that your suggestion can make a real difference and willing to play a part in the committee ... do drop us a mail. We will be more than happy to receive you with open arms.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Chris Yew]

Hi Kelvin,

Thanks for taking time to post this interesting topic and I frankly appreciate it. This is in fact a critical period for BCS as it's almost time for membership renewal, and we sure need more members to join us. Also we are looking for more suitable candidates to join in the committee (I prefer to plan well ahead for next AGM).

Well, I joined BCS for a simple reason - to be part of the Official Betta Community. I joined without hesitation becoz I know that I'll be in this hobby for long (at least more than a year, lol!). Kelvin, you've yet to tell us why you join BCS?

Currently the Aerofanatic and BettaHan forum are the most active betta forum in S'pore. I think the main reason is that these 2 boards allowed Nicks instead of Realnames to be used. You can see that most ppl will onli post when nicks are allowed so there should there be any 'irresponsible posting' by them, they still can remain anonymous. My reason for not allowing nicks to be used here is that I prefer all to know each other by their real names instead of something like hellkiller, stonebetta, etc...

The other reason I think most newbies are not joining BCS is simply becoz they are not sure how long their hobby will sustain. Of course, there is another main issue like XYZ simply do not like me, or ABC, etc.... (this is beyond our control).

Opening up the forum may not really solve the problem as we have tried that before few moths back, and the number of ppl posting is not that fantastic.

I guess it's the kind of 'no commitment' type of attitude that most hobbyists have. They prefer to come and go and don't wish to get committed to any club or forum, etc.. I'm sure there are lots of BCS members reading the forum, but juz simply refused to post here. Also, some preferred to post in other forum for the sales of bettas as other forums have more 'readership'.

Opening up the forum will also make joining BCS as member no difference from those without joining. We are already opening up some activities to non-members, and if we continued to do so for the forum, I'm afraid that the members will object to it.

Nevertheless, I'm still looking for more good answers to it.

[Chris Yew]

Hi Kelvin,

Thanks for taking time to post this interesting topic and I frankly appreciate it. This is in fact a critical period for BCS as it's almost time for membership renewal, and we sure need more members to join us. Also we are looking for more suitable candidates to join in the committee (I prefer to plan well ahead for next AGM).

Well, I joined BCS for a simple reason - to be part of the Official Betta Community. I joined without hesitation becoz I know that I'll be in this hobby for long (at least more than a year, lol!). Kelvin, you've yet to tell us why you join BCS?

Currently the Aerofanatic and BettaHan forum are the most active betta forum in S'pore. I think the main reason is that these 2 boards allowed Nicks instead of Realnames to be used. You can see that most ppl will onli post when nicks are allowed so there should there be any 'irresponsible posting' by them, they still can remain anonymous. My reason for not allowing nicks to be used here is that I prefer all to know each other by their real names instead of something like hellkiller, stonebetta, etc...

The other reason I think most newbies are not joining BCS is simply becoz they are not sure how long their hobby will sustain. Of course, there is another main issue like XYZ simply do not like me, or ABC, etc.... (this is beyond our control).

Opening up the forum may not really solve the problem as we have tried that before few moths back, and the number of ppl posting is not that fantastic.

I guess it's the kind of 'no commitment' type of attitude that most hobbyists have. They prefer to come and go and don't wish to get committed to any club or forum, etc.. I'm sure there are lots of BCS members reading the forum, but juz simply refused to post here. Also, some preferred to post in other forum for the sales of bettas as other forums have more 'readership'.

Opening up the forum will also make joining BCS as member no difference from those without joining. We are already opening up some activities to non-members, and if we continued to do so for the forum, I'm afraid that the members will object to it.

Nevertheless, I'm still looking for more good answers to it.

[Samuel Phan]

I joinned BCS simply for the reason of the love of the hobby and wanting to be involved with the official club. To be involved with the activities.

I used to be active in BettaHan but now Arofantics. Simple reason because I like Aro better (Happy ... Kelvin? =P)

But still my invilvement is greatly reduced simply because I am too tied up with my work and BCS tasks that I am to tired to do any further postings.

free up this forum to everyone will make joinning BCS seems redundant ... when that happeneds ... membership counts will drop and eventually the club will have to close down due to the lack of fundings.

So there is always the case of trying to balance the members' benefits and how to promote the hobby to the public.

But do note the the idea of opening up the forum has not been brushed aside ... in fact ... it is hotly debated amongst some of the committee members. So nothing is concrete ... we are just trying to provide the members the best value-for-money and at the same time still be able to attract new members.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Samuel Phan]

I joinned BCS simply for the reason of the love of the hobby and wanting to be involved with the official club. To be involved with the activities.

I used to be active in BettaHan but now Arofantics. Simple reason because I like Aro better (Happy ... Kelvin? =P)

But still my invilvement is greatly reduced simply because I am too tied up with my work and BCS tasks that I am to tired to do any further postings.

free up this forum to everyone will make joinning BCS seems redundant ... when that happeneds ... membership counts will drop and eventually the club will have to close down due to the lack of fundings.

So there is always the case of trying to balance the members' benefits and how to promote the hobby to the public.

But do note the the idea of opening up the forum has not been brushed aside ... in fact ... it is hotly debated amongst some of the committee members. So nothing is concrete ... we are just trying to provide the members the best value-for-money and at the same time still be able to attract new members.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Foo Hong]

Altho I am big mouth everywhere, I still reserve certain topics of discussion on our forum. Lately tho I got more involved in MBC forum,cos I thot its a projecion of BCS to our neighbours, that we are just as gud if not better than our northern counterparts.

If you look at stats, I am probably one of the highest topioc poster on our forum. But I also run out of questions sometimes. I wld encourage people to post more frequently. Hvg said, lesser may not be a bad sign as those on bettahan are by newbies and sometimes topics are plain silly and irrelevant. Topics like, where can I buy dahpnia, where is cheapest hikari worms, why must jar bettas, etc....topics hv been posted over n over but raeders are just plain lazy to dig up the archive. what bettahan is gud for is ...selling bettas.\\

ALtho I do chat a bit there, I do not do it entirely as u never know who are these people reading...like chris said, nicknames is all u know. On many occasions I hv answers to some questions on bettahan, but i just choose to be silent. sometimes i do in trying to get more mbrs. got 1 last month btw.

I feel proud to be part of an official club, i/o a tom-dick-harry mailing list, which has 'no government'.
Also, I might part with certain fishes to mbrs but not to bettahaners, not at least at a higher price. if I had the call, I will close bettahan.

[Foo Hong]

Altho I am big mouth everywhere, I still reserve certain topics of discussion on our forum. Lately tho I got more involved in MBC forum,cos I thot its a projecion of BCS to our neighbours, that we are just as gud if not better than our northern counterparts.

If you look at stats, I am probably one of the highest topioc poster on our forum. But I also run out of questions sometimes. I wld encourage people to post more frequently. Hvg said, lesser may not be a bad sign as those on bettahan are by newbies and sometimes topics are plain silly and irrelevant. Topics like, where can I buy dahpnia, where is cheapest hikari worms, why must jar bettas, etc....topics hv been posted over n over but raeders are just plain lazy to dig up the archive. what bettahan is gud for is ...selling bettas.\\

ALtho I do chat a bit there, I do not do it entirely as u never know who are these people reading...like chris said, nicknames is all u know. On many occasions I hv answers to some questions on bettahan, but i just choose to be silent. sometimes i do in trying to get more mbrs. got 1 last month btw.

I feel proud to be part of an official club, i/o a tom-dick-harry mailing list, which has 'no government'.
Also, I might part with certain fishes to mbrs but not to bettahaners, not at least at a higher price. if I had the call, I will close bettahan.

[Samuel Phan]

:) I am not worried for you ...

[Samuel Phan]

:) I am not worried for you ...

[Foo Hong]

Yr concerns re the traffic in BCS forum was discussed at length by the previous protem committe n the presnt comm as well.

I do agree fully that bettahan is used as a guage of popularity of bettas. Ther are many people there I beleive who are the comn go type n longterm hobbyist. And god knows how many and who they are !

I do respect the rules there on bettahan n shld the moderator there decide one day to cancel all sales post, I will follow. The fact that bettahan exist first before BCS and that it was a mailing list i/o a forum like this makes it probably more convenient or user-friendly. we also have talked abt modelling oru forum likewise. oie, when u open up yr mailbox u will see mails entitled "[betta club singapore]Is CT plakat s new strain".

It apparently didnt materialise, maybe sam can comment as I cant remember the reasons.

[Foo Hong]

Yr concerns re the traffic in BCS forum was discussed at length by the previous protem committe n the presnt comm as well.

I do agree fully that bettahan is used as a guage of popularity of bettas. Ther are many people there I beleive who are the comn go type n longterm hobbyist. And god knows how many and who they are !

I do respect the rules there on bettahan n shld the moderator there decide one day to cancel all sales post, I will follow. The fact that bettahan exist first before BCS and that it was a mailing list i/o a forum like this makes it probably more convenient or user-friendly. we also have talked abt modelling oru forum likewise. oie, when u open up yr mailbox u will see mails entitled "[betta club singapore]Is CT plakat s new strain".

It apparently didnt materialise, maybe sam can comment as I cant remember the reasons.

[Foo Hong]

<<flaming and stuff like that on forum, isnt really bad for the hobby i think. strong remarks have to be made sometimes, if you believe strongly in them
believe in power of bettahan..... >>

I would disagree that flaming isnt bad on forums. In a largely accessible mailing list, one comment made by someone is read by several hundreds of people on the list. I do not see it being very different from say someone who post a 'compliant' on the straits times forum. Where a flaming remark is made based on groundless accusations, childishness, oethr other personal selfish reasons.....then yes I do agree that strong reply to correct the matter is required cos the accusation would amount to defamation. If flaming is allowed, in no time, the entire forum will be as messy as israel vz. lebanon! Hence, the need to moderate, just like the united nations inspectors would check on saddam hussien's army.

You have a point on newbies. I wasnt referring to all newbie questions on bettahan...just some. a correction.

[Foo Hong]

<<flaming and stuff like that on forum, isnt really bad for the hobby i think. strong remarks have to be made sometimes, if you believe strongly in them
believe in power of bettahan..... >>

I would disagree that flaming isnt bad on forums. In a largely accessible mailing list, one comment made by someone is read by several hundreds of people on the list. I do not see it being very different from say someone who post a 'compliant' on the straits times forum. Where a flaming remark is made based on groundless accusations, childishness, oethr other personal selfish reasons.....then yes I do agree that strong reply to correct the matter is required cos the accusation would amount to defamation. If flaming is allowed, in no time, the entire forum will be as messy as israel vz. lebanon! Hence, the need to moderate, just like the united nations inspectors would check on saddam hussien's army.

You have a point on newbies. I wasnt referring to all newbie questions on bettahan...just some. a correction.

[Phil]

"2) I started the discussion on lowering fees, and fees dropped evetually".

The BCS did not reduce its fee, hence the above statement is erroneous. This needs to be highlighted because this statement is misleading and may result in complications. The BCS granted a students' rate, mainly to encourage the younger generation to join the club, so that they will know more about bettas and hopefully take up the hobby more seriously. I am in agreement with Foo Hong that flaming does not serve its purpose and that any disagreement between two parties is best resolved privately. Hopefully our members will learn not to resort to childish behaviours and remarks when resolving an issue.

[Phil]

"2) I started the discussion on lowering fees, and fees dropped evetually".

The BCS did not reduce its fee, hence the above statement is erroneous. This needs to be highlighted because this statement is misleading and may result in complications. The BCS granted a students' rate, mainly to encourage the younger generation to join the club, so that they will know more about bettas and hopefully take up the hobby more seriously. I am in agreement with Foo Hong that flaming does not serve its purpose and that any disagreement between two parties is best resolved privately. Hopefully our members will learn not to resort to childish behaviours and remarks when resolving an issue.

[Steven Cheng]

Hi, as a new member (sep 2002), I do not know much about the history of the club etc. I would like to say that selling/trading of fish is very important to the hobby. I think the club is also working on this area by setting up the on-line auction platform and organising road shows, which, I felt, received very good response from the public. The LFS trend moving towards specialising in show betta (e.g. Betta House, Betta Kingdom, and White Aquarium etc) shows that betta is gaining more and more popularity in the fish keeping community. BCS should capitalise on this, and formulate member attracting activities like road shows, betta keeping talks,and new member parkages (e.g. free starter pairs, breeding kits etc). BCS can also make its presence felt by distributing/selling posters, T-shirts, etc at these specialist shops. We must recognise that there are many levels of involvement and many types of activities in the betta keeping hobby that make up the pyramid structure of the betta lovers community. As Kelvin has said, newbies questions & FAQs are very important to new comers to the hobby (I got most of my answers in Apr/May 2002 mainly from US websites), BCS's website should be the choice website for every betta lovers. The BCS Forum can also have areas designated for newbies and non-members, so that some beginners' questions could get answered. Serious discussions and alternative views must be encouraged as long as they are geared towards the betterment of the hobby and BCS, and that remarks made are not finger pointing and becoming personal attacks.

[Steven Cheng]

Hi, as a new member (sep 2002), I do not know much about the history of the club etc. I would like to say that selling/trading of fish is very important to the hobby. I think the club is also working on this area by setting up the on-line auction platform and organising road shows, which, I felt, received very good response from the public. The LFS trend moving towards specialising in show betta (e.g. Betta House, Betta Kingdom, and White Aquarium etc) shows that betta is gaining more and more popularity in the fish keeping community. BCS should capitalise on this, and formulate member attracting activities like road shows, betta keeping talks,and new member parkages (e.g. free starter pairs, breeding kits etc). BCS can also make its presence felt by distributing/selling posters, T-shirts, etc at these specialist shops. We must recognise that there are many levels of involvement and many types of activities in the betta keeping hobby that make up the pyramid structure of the betta lovers community. As Kelvin has said, newbies questions & FAQs are very important to new comers to the hobby (I got most of my answers in Apr/May 2002 mainly from US websites), BCS's website should be the choice website for every betta lovers. The BCS Forum can also have areas designated for newbies and non-members, so that some beginners' questions could get answered. Serious discussions and alternative views must be encouraged as long as they are geared towards the betterment of the hobby and BCS, and that remarks made are not finger pointing and becoming personal attacks.

[kennho]

Since this topic is so hot, why not I tell a story.

Many years ago, I was a breeder and a show tank discus-aquascaping keeper. Practically, there are a vast information on a totally different ways of keeping difficult fishes. That thought of "selling" on net was somehow back-fired during those period of time whereby other competitors will start to flame up topics that discourage the sale. Kelvin, you are not alone you know. I experienced what you have but I am not so strong to continue the fight and eventually I quitted breeding. However, I did not give up this hobby completely as I am move myself more towards goldfish keeping. Wanted to join a pte group but was rejected due to some reasons. One of the member, now my mentor, did said something .. " go back and learn your fish, in a few years time, come back again."

It took me 5 years, painfully rejected 5 yrs. Maintaining as an low graded apprentise of goldfish keeper. Now, a recognised member, the knowledge exchange has not only evolve around better keeping, but the sensational feeling of great achievement and continuous improvement kept the energy going, deepen the loves of this hobby.

60 bucks a year is expensive ? Try talking about 100 bucks a month to join a pte club. What kept me from thinking of this 60 bucks is wat value can BCS provide.

As for BCS, I must say it's new. There are a lot of things that can be improve. Profitable or not, as a hobby group, the objectives and values should be clear and concise and tailored so that "BCS's website should be the choice website for every betta lovers." (thanks Steven Cheng). The present activities are wonderfully attractive, bring people together and probably allowing more "start-ups" and potential "member". It will take sometime to formulate out an expanded role as an official club of the local scene and a coordinator in a regional level.

Kelvin brought up this earlier "free up this forum....to everyone". I would say NO WAY. In fact, many aqua-clubs do have a website but only a handful got forum that are restricted to members. The club forum should be value added and an environment that information exchange should be somewhat in harmony. Those do not have a forum would actually have regular meetings and talks and a mail-list for announcements. Opening to public invites what you have seen and experience in the "outside world".

I need a rest. Have a great day.

[kennho]

Since this topic is so hot, why not I tell a story.

Many years ago, I was a breeder and a show tank discus-aquascaping keeper. Practically, there are a vast information on a totally different ways of keeping difficult fishes. That thought of "selling" on net was somehow back-fired during those period of time whereby other competitors will start to flame up topics that discourage the sale. Kelvin, you are not alone you know. I experienced what you have but I am not so strong to continue the fight and eventually I quitted breeding. However, I did not give up this hobby completely as I am move myself more towards goldfish keeping. Wanted to join a pte group but was rejected due to some reasons. One of the member, now my mentor, did said something .. " go back and learn your fish, in a few years time, come back again."

It took me 5 years, painfully rejected 5 yrs. Maintaining as an low graded apprentise of goldfish keeper. Now, a recognised member, the knowledge exchange has not only evolve around better keeping, but the sensational feeling of great achievement and continuous improvement kept the energy going, deepen the loves of this hobby.

60 bucks a year is expensive ? Try talking about 100 bucks a month to join a pte club. What kept me from thinking of this 60 bucks is wat value can BCS provide.

As for BCS, I must say it's new. There are a lot of things that can be improve. Profitable or not, as a hobby group, the objectives and values should be clear and concise and tailored so that "BCS's website should be the choice website for every betta lovers." (thanks Steven Cheng). The present activities are wonderfully attractive, bring people together and probably allowing more "start-ups" and potential "member". It will take sometime to formulate out an expanded role as an official club of the local scene and a coordinator in a regional level.

Kelvin brought up this earlier "free up this forum....to everyone". I would say NO WAY. In fact, many aqua-clubs do have a website but only a handful got forum that are restricted to members. The club forum should be value added and an environment that information exchange should be somewhat in harmony. Those do not have a forum would actually have regular meetings and talks and a mail-list for announcements. Opening to public invites what you have seen and experience in the "outside world".

I need a rest. Have a great day.

[Phil]

I believe that the BCS Committee is always on the lookout for constructive criticisms and ways to make the club better for its members. There are events being organised but I did noticed that few members attend these events. Perhaps you guys could be more precise on what you want from the club, which should include your participation as well, to make the club a better place for all.

Kelvin, thanks the clarification on students membership does make a difference.

[Phil]

I believe that the BCS Committee is always on the lookout for constructive criticisms and ways to make the club better for its members. There are events being organised but I did noticed that few members attend these events. Perhaps you guys could be more precise on what you want from the club, which should include your participation as well, to make the club a better place for all.

Kelvin, thanks the clarification on students membership does make a difference.

[Foo Hong]

I must say all these contributions r constructive eventually twds BCS. I agree with the point of what makes it worth is not the 60 bcuks, is what the BCS can do.

Hwoever, as I have posted on bettahan before repsonding to posts tehre, there are a lot of gud suggestions. however, unless one steps forward and start doing it, suggestions are as gud as no good bcos BCS is always short of manpower. Which is why there is a call for more comm / sub comm mbrs in a separate thread.

As for kennyfishing, its already case closed. Kelvin, anyway the return we gave to him was not bcos his english was not so gud. In fact his english was gud enuf for me to understand at least. It was largely bcos he challenge our integrity of a non-profit organisation, and also I believe he had an open house on same day as our AGM.

[Foo Hong]

I must say all these contributions r constructive eventually twds BCS. I agree with the point of what makes it worth is not the 60 bcuks, is what the BCS can do.

Hwoever, as I have posted on bettahan before repsonding to posts tehre, there are a lot of gud suggestions. however, unless one steps forward and start doing it, suggestions are as gud as no good bcos BCS is always short of manpower. Which is why there is a call for more comm / sub comm mbrs in a separate thread.

As for kennyfishing, its already case closed. Kelvin, anyway the return we gave to him was not bcos his english was not so gud. In fact his english was gud enuf for me to understand at least. It was largely bcos he challenge our integrity of a non-profit organisation, and also I believe he had an open house on same day as our AGM.

[Samuel Phan]

Hi All,

To materialise all the suggestions will probably take not just one committee to complete but it should be a constant improvement which will eventually mature the club to be one that is good for most.

Keep any of your constructive suggestions coming and if possible ... play a part in what your preach. BCS needs your help ... if you think that there is at something that you can offer (no matter how little it may be) ... the club welcomes you.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Samuel Phan]

Hi All,

To materialise all the suggestions will probably take not just one committee to complete but it should be a constant improvement which will eventually mature the club to be one that is good for most.

Keep any of your constructive suggestions coming and if possible ... play a part in what your preach. BCS needs your help ... if you think that there is at something that you can offer (no matter how little it may be) ... the club welcomes you.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Dr Hsu]

It's late and I've just come back from work, a late meeting, dinner and getting the next 2 days bird food organized. Not packed yet and have to get up at 5 am to make it to Dr Sun's place by 6.30am...but thought I'd give my 2 cents worth since I will be away (in KL:)) the next 2 days....

I find that a lot of people always ask "what do I get from joining BCS?", or any other club/cause for that matter. This is a Singaporean disease. Why must it always be what you get? Has anyone thought of "What can I contribute to the betta hobby in Singapore by joining BCS?".

When the call for hobbyist interested in forming a formal club came last year, I volunteered (albeit late due to being busy) as I thought I could contribute something in terms of ideas, club discussions, helping to organize talks etc. I did not (and still do not) consider myself to be very knowledgeble in the finer details of keeping bettas, but I think I can contribute in other ways and I hope I have done so.

Ideas are easy - the committee has brought up, discussed to death, and killed/shelved many ideas due to the reality of it all when details are actually discussed - some are just too expensive; some take too much manpower; some require expertise that we do not have, some are downright illegal/in bad taste! etc etc. What we want are people who can "do" and not "say". Words are cheap, action is not.

$60/$30 is not much nowadays. It is a matter of priority and whether you want to be a member of the offical betta organization in Singapore. God knows I have spent much more than that in helping to make our events successful. Perhaps I can afford it, but if this was a cause I did not believe in, I wouldn't put in $1. You don't have to spend another cent helping in the club. Your presence attending events is good, actually helping out in the events is better, and helping in the committee is best!

FAQ's etc on our website is forthcoming...late, partly due to my delay in putting out the second issue of the newsletter. We have a FAQ done up and it will be posted after publishing in our newsletter. Putting up something on a website is no easy affair if it is not a personal website: Personal websites are easy - if you decide you want to put something in there, you just do so. In a club/association/company website, the content must be done by someone, who then passes it on to the webmaster, who will then post it. All this coming from people who work full time....sometimes it gets delayed or put aside as other more pressing matters arise.

We are getting there - slowly but surely....give us some time, and give us some of your time!

As an aside: Proper English IS very important!!! As you have seen, just the omission of one word can change the whole meaning of a sentence. Cut out the SMS language as well...it will eventually sneak into your normal writing. Thank God you do not take classes under my collegue in NUS - she gives a "0" if you do not write in proper sentences and proper English. Not a flame, just some advice.

OK, enough of preaching and overspent my 2 cents....time to pack and sleep![|)]

[Dr Hsu]

It's late and I've just come back from work, a late meeting, dinner and getting the next 2 days bird food organized. Not packed yet and have to get up at 5 am to make it to Dr Sun's place by 6.30am...but thought I'd give my 2 cents worth since I will be away (in KL:)) the next 2 days....

I find that a lot of people always ask "what do I get from joining BCS?", or any other club/cause for that matter. This is a Singaporean disease. Why must it always be what you get? Has anyone thought of "What can I contribute to the betta hobby in Singapore by joining BCS?".

When the call for hobbyist interested in forming a formal club came last year, I volunteered (albeit late due to being busy) as I thought I could contribute something in terms of ideas, club discussions, helping to organize talks etc. I did not (and still do not) consider myself to be very knowledgeble in the finer details of keeping bettas, but I think I can contribute in other ways and I hope I have done so.

Ideas are easy - the committee has brought up, discussed to death, and killed/shelved many ideas due to the reality of it all when details are actually discussed - some are just too expensive; some take too much manpower; some require expertise that we do not have, some are downright illegal/in bad taste! etc etc. What we want are people who can "do" and not "say". Words are cheap, action is not.

$60/$30 is not much nowadays. It is a matter of priority and whether you want to be a member of the offical betta organization in Singapore. God knows I have spent much more than that in helping to make our events successful. Perhaps I can afford it, but if this was a cause I did not believe in, I wouldn't put in $1. You don't have to spend another cent helping in the club. Your presence attending events is good, actually helping out in the events is better, and helping in the committee is best!

FAQ's etc on our website is forthcoming...late, partly due to my delay in putting out the second issue of the newsletter. We have a FAQ done up and it will be posted after publishing in our newsletter. Putting up something on a website is no easy affair if it is not a personal website: Personal websites are easy - if you decide you want to put something in there, you just do so. In a club/association/company website, the content must be done by someone, who then passes it on to the webmaster, who will then post it. All this coming from people who work full time....sometimes it gets delayed or put aside as other more pressing matters arise.

We are getting there - slowly but surely....give us some time, and give us some of your time!

As an aside: Proper English IS very important!!! As you have seen, just the omission of one word can change the whole meaning of a sentence. Cut out the SMS language as well...it will eventually sneak into your normal writing. Thank God you do not take classes under my collegue in NUS - she gives a "0" if you do not write in proper sentences and proper English. Not a flame, just some advice.

OK, enough of preaching and overspent my 2 cents....time to pack and sleep![|)]

[Jonathan_Tan]

actually i find that the people in the bcs committee should be more friendly towards all. especially the newbies. being one myself, i really appreciate it when someone senior gives me advice. Maybe if we all change our attitudes a bit and be more friendly and open, people may have a better impression of bcs and erase the 'elite' impression of the club.
in my opinion,joining the club does'nt take good fish or lousy fish, its whether or not u want to be involved in the activities that revovle around bettas. i personally think that if we are more friendly, it will give others an impression that we are like a warm family helping each other. it will let others feel ' at home ' which will let pple feel good about joining the club. will seem like a condusive environment to discuss abt bettas which is the centre of focus.
this may ruffle a few feathers but this is my view about this problem and my humble suggestion. hope u guys will understand.
regards,
Jonathan

[Jonathan_Tan]

actually i find that the people in the bcs committee should be more friendly towards all. especially the newbies. being one myself, i really appreciate it when someone senior gives me advice. Maybe if we all change our attitudes a bit and be more friendly and open, people may have a better impression of bcs and erase the 'elite' impression of the club.
in my opinion,joining the club does'nt take good fish or lousy fish, its whether or not u want to be involved in the activities that revovle around bettas. i personally think that if we are more friendly, it will give others an impression that we are like a warm family helping each other. it will let others feel ' at home ' which will let pple feel good about joining the club. will seem like a condusive environment to discuss abt bettas which is the centre of focus.
this may ruffle a few feathers but this is my view about this problem and my humble suggestion. hope u guys will understand.
regards,
Jonathan

[ben fox wong]

original posting deleted.

[ben fox wong]

original posting deleted.

[Phil]

Statements and suggestions are always easy to make. But if you are truely sincere about tailoring the club into what you consider as an ideal club, then one should not run away from active participation. Time is what we make out for ourselves. All of us are busy individuals but for the love of the bettas, we all do make our contributions in whatever way we can through proper time management. I believe that when there is a will there is a way. What better way than to participate and gear the club towards your vision.

[Phil]

Statements and suggestions are always easy to make. But if you are truely sincere about tailoring the club into what you consider as an ideal club, then one should not run away from active participation. Time is what we make out for ourselves. All of us are busy individuals but for the love of the bettas, we all do make our contributions in whatever way we can through proper time management. I believe that when there is a will there is a way. What better way than to participate and gear the club towards your vision.

[Toh Chen Han]

I joined because I found the BCS committee to be an approachable and down-to-earth lot. Don't like snobs and would definitely not have bothered had the people I met at the Roadshow been anything less than accomodating to a beginner. But beyond the polite conversation, the people I met and spoke with shared information and advice readily and enthusiastically.



quote:Originally posted by Jonathan_Tan

actually i find that the people in the bcs committee should be more friendly towards all. especially the newbies. being one myself, i really appreciate it when someone senior gives me advice. Maybe if we all change our attitudes a bit and be more friendly and open, people may have a better impression of bcs and erase the 'elite' impression of the club.
in my opinion,joining the club does'nt take good fish or lousy fish, its whether or not u want to be involved in the activities that revovle around bettas. i personally think that if we are more friendly, it will give others an impression that we are like a warm family helping each other. it will let others feel ' at home ' which will let pple feel good about joining the club. will seem like a condusive environment to discuss abt bettas which is the centre of focus.
this may ruffle a few feathers but this is my view about this problem and my humble suggestion. hope u guys will understand.
regards,
Jonathan

[Toh Chen Han]

I joined because I found the BCS committee to be an approachable and down-to-earth lot. Don't like snobs and would definitely not have bothered had the people I met at the Roadshow been anything less than accomodating to a beginner. But beyond the polite conversation, the people I met and spoke with shared information and advice readily and enthusiastically.



quote:Originally posted by Jonathan_Tan

actually i find that the people in the bcs committee should be more friendly towards all. especially the newbies. being one myself, i really appreciate it when someone senior gives me advice. Maybe if we all change our attitudes a bit and be more friendly and open, people may have a better impression of bcs and erase the 'elite' impression of the club.
in my opinion,joining the club does'nt take good fish or lousy fish, its whether or not u want to be involved in the activities that revovle around bettas. i personally think that if we are more friendly, it will give others an impression that we are like a warm family helping each other. it will let others feel ' at home ' which will let pple feel good about joining the club. will seem like a condusive environment to discuss abt bettas which is the centre of focus.
this may ruffle a few feathers but this is my view about this problem and my humble suggestion. hope u guys will understand.
regards,
Jonathan

[Phil]

Yes do feel free to approach us if you do want our help. We are more than willing to share our experience with members since we are "one family". It is really impossible for us to answer your query when we don't know what advice you want. There is really no need to be shy, we are all approachable and you have my assurance that we would not eat you up.

[Phil]

Yes do feel free to approach us if you do want our help. We are more than willing to share our experience with members since we are "one family". It is really impossible for us to answer your query when we don't know what advice you want. There is really no need to be shy, we are all approachable and you have my assurance that we would not eat you up.

[Foo Hong]

Well for all those who have questions, feel free to ask by posting. If you do not ask, how will the others know what area of help u need?

I always see the same few posting mesages. I take that to mean that the rest are pretty comfortable. There are no stupid questions, just ask !

[Foo Hong]

Well for all those who have questions, feel free to ask by posting. If you do not ask, how will the others know what area of help u need?

I always see the same few posting mesages. I take that to mean that the rest are pretty comfortable. There are no stupid questions, just ask !

[Phil]

There is a difference between having high volume of post and informative and constructive dialogue in forums. It is definitely not my vision to participate in any forum merely to create volume like many bettahan members have done so in Bettahan or arofanatic forums. The BCS do not want the same rubbish, childish nonsence that have perpectuated both these forum. BCS committee members are not out to collect stars and popularity, but to help members out in time of need. I would want a respected betta club rather than a fish market, so having volumineous post is certainly not a criteria. As for opinions,well sociologically people have a tendency to shy away from reality and believe themselves to be right and all others who oppose them wrong. Hence differences will exist. But the club has to stick to principles to maintain its goal and not be side-tracked by a barrage of critisms. The BCS has to differntiate between constructive It is really not possible to please everyone.

[Phil]

There is a difference between having high volume of post and informative and constructive dialogue in forums. It is definitely not my vision to participate in any forum merely to create volume like many bettahan members have done so in Bettahan or arofanatic forums. The BCS do not want the same rubbish, childish nonsence that have perpectuated both these forum. BCS committee members are not out to collect stars and popularity, but to help members out in time of need. I would want a respected betta club rather than a fish market, so having volumineous post is certainly not a criteria. As for opinions,well sociologically people have a tendency to shy away from reality and believe themselves to be right and all others who oppose them wrong. Hence differences will exist. But the club has to stick to principles to maintain its goal and not be side-tracked by a barrage of critisms. The BCS has to differntiate between constructive It is really not possible to please everyone.

[Foo Hong]

Kelvin,
I take yr point that some people on other mailing list may find us unfriendly, for whatever reasons. But then I wouldnt worry too much if we are indeed not. People will be able to tell the truth over time. There will always be some small number of people who will never agree on anything. Some people could merely use the 'unfriendly' representation as a means to show their dislike bcos they couldnt get hold of certain info/previleges/etc which BCS members deserved.

Ok lets be more specific and refer to bettahan. I had been on the MBA forum and also recently back from the KL show. I can say that the betta scene there is much more healthy. One reason I could think of is there is a controlled manner in which bettas are released in Msia, very much resemble the states. Also, no one sells fishes on the Forum like what u see in bettahan, which is like a fish market. Gud show bettas are not readily available in LFS, and they dont have farms that raise gud bettas. People flock to the show to auction for fishes, paying for the genes. Cos they know thats the only time they get these. Sellers do not easily reduce the price for a gud fish.

And....people are very friendly to everyone!

[Foo Hong]

Kelvin,
I take yr point that some people on other mailing list may find us unfriendly, for whatever reasons. But then I wouldnt worry too much if we are indeed not. People will be able to tell the truth over time. There will always be some small number of people who will never agree on anything. Some people could merely use the 'unfriendly' representation as a means to show their dislike bcos they couldnt get hold of certain info/previleges/etc which BCS members deserved.

Ok lets be more specific and refer to bettahan. I had been on the MBA forum and also recently back from the KL show. I can say that the betta scene there is much more healthy. One reason I could think of is there is a controlled manner in which bettas are released in Msia, very much resemble the states. Also, no one sells fishes on the Forum like what u see in bettahan, which is like a fish market. Gud show bettas are not readily available in LFS, and they dont have farms that raise gud bettas. People flock to the show to auction for fishes, paying for the genes. Cos they know thats the only time they get these. Sellers do not easily reduce the price for a gud fish.

And....people are very friendly to everyone!

[ben fox wong]

original posting deleted

[ben fox wong]

original posting deleted

[Foo Hong]

I was the greatest sucker. auction teh fishes for 300 rgt, but bot 1 red fish for 250 rgt. came back and realise it has more irids than desired..lol!

No, our members were busy bidding n pushing up the prices !

[Foo Hong]

I was the greatest sucker. auction teh fishes for 300 rgt, but bot 1 red fish for 250 rgt. came back and realise it has more irids than desired..lol!

No, our members were busy bidding n pushing up the prices !

[Phil]

Hi Kelvin, why don't you just be upfront and just state who your are refering to in your statement.

"also fed up with some other's comments which try to shoot ppl indirectly (ben its not you) and i will have to watch my english. yeah ppl, i'm still extremely sore arguing with someone who answers in very high class english but avoids all accusation made".

If it is me that you are refering too, then I sincerely do hope that you are not childish enough to bring up old issues. As a member of BCS, I am treating you as a fellow member of the group and i am willing to let bygones be bygones. I have not hurled any accusations at you or anyone at the BCS. In fact, I do welcome your participation in the club and certainly hope that you will be able to contribute more. So please stop fantasizing and living in the illusion that I am out to get you. Life is too short for all this. I hope this clarifies my stand.


If you are refering to me just say it. Stop running in circles. What accusations are you refering to this time?

[Phil]

Hi Kelvin, why don't you just be upfront and just state who your are refering to in your statement.

"also fed up with some other's comments which try to shoot ppl indirectly (ben its not you) and i will have to watch my english. yeah ppl, i'm still extremely sore arguing with someone who answers in very high class english but avoids all accusation made".

If it is me that you are refering too, then I sincerely do hope that you are not childish enough to bring up old issues. As a member of BCS, I am treating you as a fellow member of the group and i am willing to let bygones be bygones. I have not hurled any accusations at you or anyone at the BCS. In fact, I do welcome your participation in the club and certainly hope that you will be able to contribute more. So please stop fantasizing and living in the illusion that I am out to get you. Life is too short for all this. I hope this clarifies my stand.


If you are refering to me just say it. Stop running in circles. What accusations are you refering to this time?

[Samuel Phan]

Hi Kelvin,

Like what Phil have said ... let bygones be bygones.

Let's discuss things with no hidden agendas and no personal grudges.

Many sees yourself and others, who are very active in the forum here and elsewhere, being the next wave of BCS members that can make a difference. So do bury the hatchet and let things go ... instead think about how you can help BCS to materialize what you have preached.

BCS needs pple like you ... with good suggestions and ideas and able to reach out to the student majority.
But BCS also need people that put what they preach into action .... hope you will be able to contribute your part to the club for the good cause of betta.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Samuel Phan]

Hi Kelvin,

Like what Phil have said ... let bygones be bygones.

Let's discuss things with no hidden agendas and no personal grudges.

Many sees yourself and others, who are very active in the forum here and elsewhere, being the next wave of BCS members that can make a difference. So do bury the hatchet and let things go ... instead think about how you can help BCS to materialize what you have preached.

BCS needs pple like you ... with good suggestions and ideas and able to reach out to the student majority.
But BCS also need people that put what they preach into action .... hope you will be able to contribute your part to the club for the good cause of betta.

With Best Regards,
Samuel Phan

[Sebas]

Oh no, guys, dont start it again. Lets just be friends, if not fellow member relationship. Kelvin: thought you are having your exams soon?
Phil: Seems like you have started your own luohan breeding business? My uncle's business almost wound up now, the poor old man didnt manage to take care of the place and its become really lousy in condition.

[Sebas]

Oh no, guys, dont start it again. Lets just be friends, if not fellow member relationship. Kelvin: thought you are having your exams soon?
Phil: Seems like you have started your own luohan breeding business? My uncle's business almost wound up now, the poor old man didnt manage to take care of the place and its become really lousy in condition.

[kennho]

Kelvin, I don't think or see anyone here in this forum is trying to "bring you down". In an environment like this, I believe that you can make things straight with a better approach. You have already done so with the club decision to reduce the cost of membership for the juniors. It's not a simple decision, I believe, for the club and it's survival with such a small miserable fund. And of course, your effort for doing so is well acknowledged. In fact, in one of your posting : " its easy to give suggestion but hard to implement. well that's all i can contribute, thru giving suggestions". Imagine you are now a committee of BCS and I am throwing you with 100s of ideas. What are you going to do ? So let's drop it for now and look ahead with better things to do, or I should say, continue to dump your valued suggestions to the decision makers. Well, not everything can be implemented.

I recalled a site where I saw it grew up. It started with a handful of "forum writers". With just a couple of postings a day. Now, it has to upgrade the hardwares to cater for thousands of users online at the same time, increased the bandwidth several times over the past years and spend 100s of thousands dollar a year. Tell me how much to join a club like this ?

To run a club that is new and young, it will take a lot of energy and committment to generate sufficient income to sustain the present activities and future expansions. It is not a must for every hobbyist to join, it become a job for the committees to continuously enhance the club profiles to attract hobbyists and of course, fund.

Who don't face enemies in our daily life. We still need water from our neighbour. :)
How you would get a win-win situation out of it.


So how now ? To join or not to join ?

[kennho]

Kelvin, I don't think or see anyone here in this forum is trying to "bring you down". In an environment like this, I believe that you can make things straight with a better approach. You have already done so with the club decision to reduce the cost of membership for the juniors. It's not a simple decision, I believe, for the club and it's survival with such a small miserable fund. And of course, your effort for doing so is well acknowledged. In fact, in one of your posting : " its easy to give suggestion but hard to implement. well that's all i can contribute, thru giving suggestions". Imagine you are now a committee of BCS and I am throwing you with 100s of ideas. What are you going to do ? So let's drop it for now and look ahead with better things to do, or I should say, continue to dump your valued suggestions to the decision makers. Well, not everything can be implemented.

I recalled a site where I saw it grew up. It started with a handful of "forum writers". With just a couple of postings a day. Now, it has to upgrade the hardwares to cater for thousands of users online at the same time, increased the bandwidth several times over the past years and spend 100s of thousands dollar a year. Tell me how much to join a club like this ?

To run a club that is new and young, it will take a lot of energy and committment to generate sufficient income to sustain the present activities and future expansions. It is not a must for every hobbyist to join, it become a job for the committees to continuously enhance the club profiles to attract hobbyists and of course, fund.

Who don't face enemies in our daily life. We still need water from our neighbour. :)
How you would get a win-win situation out of it.


So how now ? To join or not to join ?

[Foo Hong]

Kelvin,
bygones are bygones. If you remember, there was some friction between us n peterchoo[ex pres] last year following the soft launch on bettahan when culling matter was raised. However, that is PAST n PAST means PAST. We welcome u into BCS.
Even for Kenny fishing where there was a rough exchange of words in bettahan previously, he had apologised and unless there is a repeat incident, we will similarly welcome him.

I do not blame you or the younger generation for certain feelings at times. However, I can tell you from a working executive's point of view, there is a need to be clear in what we say. Especially so on email where u cant see who is that other person. Its kinda impersonal and if managed wrongly can get really nasty. Why we must be clear? Look at the sing msian water talks. Unclear statements and interpretation of the treaty, constant change of parameters in the package etc lead to sour relations.

Like I ve posted on aerofanatics, there is no end to mbr fees discussiona altho it was gud to bring up. But then, we need to move on as well. Views will differ between people. differences shld be exchanged in a constructive manner. For example, as a side issue, I do not fully agree with MBA's HM criteria in certain aspects, however, I do not fire a missile on their forum bcos I disagree or think they are 'wrong'. Maybe I will be proven wrong eventually.

You shld attend our next gathering whatever it may be. Meet up with everyone. Very often we are more understanding to each if we have met up.

Lets put more effort on bettas instead. I believe you will put our national flag flying high one day.

[Foo Hong]

Kelvin,
bygones are bygones. If you remember, there was some friction between us n peterchoo[ex pres] last year following the soft launch on bettahan when culling matter was raised. However, that is PAST n PAST means PAST. We welcome u into BCS.
Even for Kenny fishing where there was a rough exchange of words in bettahan previously, he had apologised and unless there is a repeat incident, we will similarly welcome him.

I do not blame you or the younger generation for certain feelings at times. However, I can tell you from a working executive's point of view, there is a need to be clear in what we say. Especially so on email where u cant see who is that other person. Its kinda impersonal and if managed wrongly can get really nasty. Why we must be clear? Look at the sing msian water talks. Unclear statements and interpretation of the treaty, constant change of parameters in the package etc lead to sour relations.

Like I ve posted on aerofanatics, there is no end to mbr fees discussiona altho it was gud to bring up. But then, we need to move on as well. Views will differ between people. differences shld be exchanged in a constructive manner. For example, as a side issue, I do not fully agree with MBA's HM criteria in certain aspects, however, I do not fire a missile on their forum bcos I disagree or think they are 'wrong'. Maybe I will be proven wrong eventually.

You shld attend our next gathering whatever it may be. Meet up with everyone. Very often we are more understanding to each if we have met up.

Lets put more effort on bettas instead. I believe you will put our national flag flying high one day.

[Sebas]

Foohong, i can see you are very patriotic after the MBA excursion.[:o)] Anyway, 2 of the girls i got from you are super aggresive, with eggs but behaving like boys.
Got a question for you, thinking of crossing your redxyellow fishes to my orange, any suggestion of what may come out?

[Sebas]

Foohong, i can see you are very patriotic after the MBA excursion.[:o)] Anyway, 2 of the girls i got from you are super aggresive, with eggs but behaving like boys.
Got a question for you, thinking of crossing your redxyellow fishes to my orange, any suggestion of what may come out?

[Foo Hong]

Its off tangent on this thread so I ll keep it short. Red[yellow geno] x orange probably give you some reds and some cam reds. not sure if you get any yellows. why you wanna do this?
quote:Originally posted by Sebas

Foohong, i can see you are very patriotic after the MBA excursion.[:o)] Anyway, 2 of the girls i got from you are super aggresive, with eggs but behaving like boys.
Got a question for you, thinking of crossing your redxyellow fishes to my orange, any suggestion of what may come out?

[Foo Hong]

Its off tangent on this thread so I ll keep it short. Red[yellow geno] x orange probably give you some reds and some cam reds. not sure if you get any yellows. why you wanna do this?
quote:Originally posted by Sebas

Foohong, i can see you are very patriotic after the MBA excursion.[:o)] Anyway, 2 of the girls i got from you are super aggresive, with eggs but behaving like boys.
Got a question for you, thinking of crossing your redxyellow fishes to my orange, any suggestion of what may come out?

[Phil]

Hi Sebas,

Nice hearing from you. Are you in need of an orange female ? Do let me know what your male is. If it is a double tail then you would be better of using a ST female. If you want DTs then still use a ST female which carries DT genes. I can help you in this. Don't dilute your orange, it will be a big waste.

As for the flowerhorns, no I have not bred a single flowerhorn. Really no passion for it. I am using it more as a culling machine and selling them off to whoever is interested in them when nthey are much older. I have brought up most of the fries from you to Jkt and only kept a few here in Singapore, because I have hundreds of fries to feed them each month. Anyway do let me know if i can be of help.

[Phil]

Hi Sebas,

Nice hearing from you. Are you in need of an orange female ? Do let me know what your male is. If it is a double tail then you would be better of using a ST female. If you want DTs then still use a ST female which carries DT genes. I can help you in this. Don't dilute your orange, it will be a big waste.

As for the flowerhorns, no I have not bred a single flowerhorn. Really no passion for it. I am using it more as a culling machine and selling them off to whoever is interested in them when nthey are much older. I have brought up most of the fries from you to Jkt and only kept a few here in Singapore, because I have hundreds of fries to feed them each month. Anyway do let me know if i can be of help.

[Phil]

Oh yes Sebas, we are on the wrong thread so do move it to another or alternatively contact me privately. cheers. Sorry guys.

[Phil]

Oh yes Sebas, we are on the wrong thread so do move it to another or alternatively contact me privately. cheers. Sorry guys.

[Kelvin Tan]

thanks ppl, thanks for speaking out and allow me to understand yr guy's point of view

the way i wrote the post, was really using phil's style. its not that i wanna bring up the past but i get really heated whenever i see phil's post and how i was treated.
(1. sold lousy opaque spawn from culls
2. tried to cover up by saying i spawn culls and sold to earn money to get good opaque stock instead)
and he still talk like i'm wrong. Hell...i didnt spawn a single cents on buying opaque stock! you know i feel so pissed that i am feeling like throwing back those stupids culls he pass me last year rght back in his face, but then again i rather throw a brick, betta saver. i was treated shabbily by him thru email and even when we first meet up a year ago. I went to his place, ask him, 'what is this?", pointing to the different betta trying to ask about color and finnage, he replied 'Betta'. not once, not twice but a few times. feel so insulted man. now he call ppl childish, other betta forum rubbish and childish. is that right even?
(ok, last time post this, need to get this off my back again.... i will forget the past if he apologise but i doubt he feel he is wrong. ok ok i will stop)

yeah foohong, culling issue is over. cull as you guys like, i'll do it my way....peace! come to think about it, to me all the bcs committe and members are very nice and i have lotsa frens too. so i am curious why ppl has problem with some bcs ppl.

actually i know the fees cant be reduced much anymore, just wanted to let you guys know wht is the general feelings. and i didnt want to do the poll in bettahan coz it would be too 'public'
what i suggest is the probably, loyalty discounts be given to those that carry on to the second year. most probably felt that they didnt get their money's worth the first year (my presumption...hey i am going to use this more often so safer for me) maybe consider that.

let me get done with my exams and see what i can think of..... more ideas and idea of how i can help. i dun drive and travelling takes up a lot of time.
an idea of how i use my time. everyday 8am to 1030pm in school during term time from monday to friday. study or surf net la) sometimes take a night or two off to spend time with gf. week ends for gf. mother helps spawning and feeding. i only go back change water. feel very guilty coz mum put in lots of time and effort to help. she even buy daphnia every two days, worms etc etc. and she doesnt exactly like keeping fish!

[Kelvin Tan]

thanks ppl, thanks for speaking out and allow me to understand yr guy's point of view

the way i wrote the post, was really using phil's style. its not that i wanna bring up the past but i get really heated whenever i see phil's post and how i was treated.
(1. sold lousy opaque spawn from culls
2. tried to cover up by saying i spawn culls and sold to earn money to get good opaque stock instead)
and he still talk like i'm wrong. Hell...i didnt spawn a single cents on buying opaque stock! you know i feel so pissed that i am feeling like throwing back those stupids culls he pass me last year rght back in his face, but then again i rather throw a brick, betta saver. i was treated shabbily by him thru email and even when we first meet up a year ago. I went to his place, ask him, 'what is this?", pointing to the different betta trying to ask about color and finnage, he replied 'Betta'. not once, not twice but a few times. feel so insulted man. now he call ppl childish, other betta forum rubbish and childish. is that right even?
(ok, last time post this, need to get this off my back again.... i will forget the past if he apologise but i doubt he feel he is wrong. ok ok i will stop)

yeah foohong, culling issue is over. cull as you guys like, i'll do it my way....peace! come to think about it, to me all the bcs committe and members are very nice and i have lotsa frens too. so i am curious why ppl has problem with some bcs ppl.

actually i know the fees cant be reduced much anymore, just wanted to let you guys know wht is the general feelings. and i didnt want to do the poll in bettahan coz it would be too 'public'
what i suggest is the probably, loyalty discounts be given to those that carry on to the second year. most probably felt that they didnt get their money's worth the first year (my presumption...hey i am going to use this more often so safer for me) maybe consider that.

let me get done with my exams and see what i can think of..... more ideas and idea of how i can help. i dun drive and travelling takes up a lot of time.
an idea of how i use my time. everyday 8am to 1030pm in school during term time from monday to friday. study or surf net la) sometimes take a night or two off to spend time with gf. week ends for gf. mother helps spawning and feeding. i only go back change water. feel very guilty coz mum put in lots of time and effort to help. she even buy daphnia every two days, worms etc etc. and she doesnt exactly like keeping fish!

[Dr Hsu]

Kelvin,

You will find that the world is a better place if you give and take. You don't have to forget, just forgive and start on a new level and let the past stay in the past.

Work hard for your exams and then when it's all over, you can play hard with a clear conscious. Take it from us poor working people - school days was the time when we had the most fun and free time! Hard to believe but it is - you will find out when you start working, like poor old us! Worse when you have a family!!:D Only problem is that money is always a concern...but that's life...it never ends -> different set of money problems when you start your own life :(

Good luck in your exams and we hope to see your face in our coming events!

[Dr Hsu]

Kelvin,

You will find that the world is a better place if you give and take. You don't have to forget, just forgive and start on a new level and let the past stay in the past.

Work hard for your exams and then when it's all over, you can play hard with a clear conscious. Take it from us poor working people - school days was the time when we had the most fun and free time! Hard to believe but it is - you will find out when you start working, like poor old us! Worse when you have a family!!:D Only problem is that money is always a concern...but that's life...it never ends -> different set of money problems when you start your own life :(

Good luck in your exams and we hope to see your face in our coming events!

[Samuel Phan]

;) Yep ...

[Samuel Phan]

;) Yep ...

[Kelvin Tan]

Thanks Hsu for those words. If you dun know you are one of those which i really respect, esp for your guidance for my tortoise and those fish i got in the past! Anyway stuck to yr advice on treating my fish and it seems to be working!

i had to get that out of my system once again. Now that its done, I will be a good boy and speak nicely.

Never really intended to 'enjoy' my life in nus, already enjoyed in poly. Too old to enjoy, so just mug.

by the way if you read the way i post, its more like i'm 'talking' to a fren and you find that it will feel different. that's the way i right. so you get to see a lot of honest words.

anyway, see ya guys in dec! hope there are t shirt to sell by then! that'll make some money.

anyway why not much post on our competition? heard that rick has 200 entries le.... talk more about it on bettahan. also like who is going to set up stalls etc etc who is judge lo. dun wait till last min.

[Kelvin Tan]

Thanks Hsu for those words. If you dun know you are one of those which i really respect, esp for your guidance for my tortoise and those fish i got in the past! Anyway stuck to yr advice on treating my fish and it seems to be working!

i had to get that out of my system once again. Now that its done, I will be a good boy and speak nicely.

Never really intended to 'enjoy' my life in nus, already enjoyed in poly. Too old to enjoy, so just mug.

by the way if you read the way i post, its more like i'm 'talking' to a fren and you find that it will feel different. that's the way i right. so you get to see a lot of honest words.

anyway, see ya guys in dec! hope there are t shirt to sell by then! that'll make some money.

anyway why not much post on our competition? heard that rick has 200 entries le.... talk more about it on bettahan. also like who is going to set up stalls etc etc who is judge lo. dun wait till last min.

[ben fox wong]

its been almost a month, pple are busy with vacations, year end shopping & not forgetting the Competition. if anyone needed to cool down should have done so by now. i personally dont find this thread useful at all, as it doesnt help me to keep my fish better. at the head of the thread on pricing, i believe the existing Comm had done their homework such as cost & benefit analysis with an aim of sustained development for the Club. & since the Comm is an elected one, the decisions should be binding to all members, including new ones like myself who signed with eyes open & knowing what is the price. if not it defeats the purpose of having an elected Comm. should any member have any constructive comments & alternative feasible suggestions, he/she should bring it up at the next monthly gathering/AGM/etc. the tail part of the thread, somehow had became personal. it had been written in BettaHan B4 & even pple in BettaHan also dont want to read. i do not know Phil or Kelvin, at least not yet. hence i am not on anyone's sides. in life there are always disputes which cannot be resolved & thus should be dropped, otherwise tomorrow i would still be carrying today's stones together with tomorrow's stones, heavier burdens everyday right?

Can i propose that this thread be removed by the moderators? it does not enhance anyone's fish keeping knowledge, & it has been "on air" for sometime, so whatever there is to "let out of the system" should have evaporated like chlorine in aged water. if not it might be a laughing stock when the next "open to public" time - pple might query, "i pay $60 to join a professional club to read something i could have read in BettaHan?" anyone to second my proposal?

[ben fox wong]

its been almost a month, pple are busy with vacations, year end shopping & not forgetting the Competition. if anyone needed to cool down should have done so by now. i personally dont find this thread useful at all, as it doesnt help me to keep my fish better. at the head of the thread on pricing, i believe the existing Comm had done their homework such as cost & benefit analysis with an aim of sustained development for the Club. & since the Comm is an elected one, the decisions should be binding to all members, including new ones like myself who signed with eyes open & knowing what is the price. if not it defeats the purpose of having an elected Comm. should any member have any constructive comments & alternative feasible suggestions, he/she should bring it up at the next monthly gathering/AGM/etc. the tail part of the thread, somehow had became personal. it had been written in BettaHan B4 & even pple in BettaHan also dont want to read. i do not know Phil or Kelvin, at least not yet. hence i am not on anyone's sides. in life there are always disputes which cannot be resolved & thus should be dropped, otherwise tomorrow i would still be carrying today's stones together with tomorrow's stones, heavier burdens everyday right?

Can i propose that this thread be removed by the moderators? it does not enhance anyone's fish keeping knowledge, & it has been "on air" for sometime, so whatever there is to "let out of the system" should have evaporated like chlorine in aged water. if not it might be a laughing stock when the next "open to public" time - pple might query, "i pay $60 to join a professional club to read something i could have read in BettaHan?" anyone to second my proposal?

[ben fox wong]

its been almost a month, pple are busy with vacations, year end shopping & not forgetting the Competition. if anyone needed to cool down should have done so by now. i personally dont find this thread useful at all, as it doesnt help me to keep my fish better. at the head of the thread on pricing, i believe the existing Comm had done their homework such as cost & benefit analysis with an aim of sustained development for the Club. & since the Comm is an elected one, the decisions should be binding to all members, including new ones like myself who signed with eyes open & knowing what is the price. if not it defeats the purpose of having an elected Comm. should any member have any constructive comments & alternative feasible suggestions, he/she should bring it up at the next monthly gathering/AGM/etc. the tail part of the thread, somehow had became personal. it had been written in BettaHan B4 & even pple in BettaHan also dont want to read. i do not know Phil or Kelvin, at least not yet. hence i am not on anyone's sides. in life there are always disputes which cannot be resolved & thus should be dropped, otherwise tomorrow i would still be carrying today's stones together with tomorrow's stones, heavier burdens everyday right?

Can i propose that this thread be removed by the moderators? it does not enhance anyone's fish keeping knowledge, & it has been "on air" for sometime, so whatever there is to "let out of the system" should have evaporated like chlorine in aged water. if not it might be a laughing stock when the next "open to public" time - pple might query, "i pay $60 to join a professional club to read something i could have read in BettaHan?" anyone to second my proposal?

[Myron Tay]

Ben - I respectfully disagree.

I think it is vital for a club - just like a commercial company - to justify constantly the reason for its existance. If it does not serve any purpose, we are wasting valuable time and resources. So allow me to continue the debate.

To produce world class bettas (bred by Singapore hobbyists), you need to provide incentives for Singapore hobbyists.

These incentives can be through competition.

To organise these competitions, you need some people and funds.

This organisation (to organise the competitions) need not be BCS, but it has to be an organisation that is dedicated to the same results as BCS is. The fact is that there were no betta competitions before BCS.

BCS aims to assist in placing Singapore on the betta world map and I am asking all to support BCS in its efforts. If there are insufficient members to support it, BCS would not exist. Unless another organisation like BCS comes up to take BCS's place, I am confident there would not be many world class bettas bred in Singapore.

By joining BCS, this is what you are saying: I believe that we need an organisation like BCS in Singapore to provide incentives within hobbyists in Singapore to produce world class lines so that all Singaporeans can enjoy.

If one wishes to see world class bettas in Singapore but does not join BCS, in effect, it means that this person hopes that some other people would support the efforts so that he sees world class bettas in Singapore. He would hope to see the results without putting in the support / provide the incentives to make his dream come true. If he is a breeder, he would be find it very difficult to work without the incentives and lessons competitions provide.

This is my personal view.

[Kelvin Tan]

as i mentioned in previous post, how much support do we really get from bcs in improving lines?

[Myron Tay]

In my opinion, lots, though perhaps it can improve in certain areas like sharing of information (as you have mentioned).

But sharing of information is only aspect of what BCS is about, Kelvin. There is a lot of effort put into organising competitions. As mentioned in my post above, it is vital that we have competitions if we hope to improve our lines. In view of the fact that we have limited manpower and that there were no betta competitions before BCS came along, I think we have come a long way in this particular aspect. And we would continually need people to volunteer in this aspect as it needs a lot of effort and attention to organise such competitions.

Between improved sharing of information / fish and organising competition, if you ask me which one is more important at this stage of our development, I would say organising competition.

On the issue of sharing information / fish, can BCS dictate who shares fish with whom? Do we want BCS to do that?

quote:Originally posted by Kelvin Tan

as i mentioned in previous post, how much support do we really get from bcs in improving lines?

[Kelvin Tan]

basically my questions and those i posted in the other post, is what a non member would immediately think of when i read yr post.
'things like hey, how come my fren join but his fish still not world class'
'join already then singapore betta become world class?" etc etc
thats why... not against you. its how a 'outsider' would look.

actually i think White Aquarium has done more for singapore betta in improving standards by selling quality fish at low low prices. see almost all those interested in HM has owned a HM.

[Foo Hong]

Kelvin,
I think you have just spoken for quite a few outsiders in yr last comment. But I guess just by aligning that one didnt get fishes he requested the moment he asked for to being not getting help in BCS is not quite fair a comment. Help comes in many ways. I know a lot of people's first question is - if I joined for $60, will I ever get a pair of fish that is worth more than $60 to start breeding a line of fish. Otherwise what help? What benefit? I think this is very narrow one-sided attitude.

Yes even I share fishes some red fishes with Myron. But I have never ever insist which fish I want from him to use, unless he agrees. We decided bcos we were mutually agreable to playing with red lines. WHile I do request and vice versa, the other party should not be made uncomfortable or put in a position that he is obliged. Everyone has to have his right as to what he does. I respect that decision that every breeder has to keep his best fishes, which is what drives him to work on his lines.

Neither Myron or myself have got our perfect red fish yet. And I wont want to have an identical looking fish as his. Otherwise, at any show, our fishes will look like twins and wont be challenging.

To answer yr question of whether people can help in terms of sharing their fishes. It is already taking place albeit not like teh way people are sharing their handphones or cigarette lighters. Edwin had a yellow male from me, Sam had a female. Hsu had a steel blue male from me. However, I can openly declare that I only share with selected people so far.....cos I think these are people I am comfortable with and have been very courteous, polite and etc etc. This probably will be more apparent when we have a regular monthly meeting. I would certainly think of bringing some fishes to such gathering TO BE GIVEN FREE to certain people who are serious and sincere and willing to try. But as many people know I do not have much fishes contrary to what people think.

May I also just comment. I think yr fishes look wonderful. and there isnt a real need to desperately look for outcrosses. Sometimes, outcrosse makes it worse. Often I hear people saying, oh if I dont outcross my line will crash in the next generation. How true is that? the only way to improve yr line is by line breeding, and has nothing to do with effecting the health of the fish. The problem with a lot of people is they dont line breed. just give up at F1. How can? The HM is not gonna drop from the sky.

Altho I breed one hell lot of fish, I dont have many available cos most of what I have are for my own display mostly, just display cos I enjoy seeing my own hard work results. While I manage like 8 diff strains of about 2 lines each. But I never had 2000 or 3000 adult fishes. I have found formy case that I need to keep very very low quantities. And I dont even have enuf nice fishes to fill up my own display. I also advocate that every breeder shld bred their own distinct line of fish. I dont always have good fishes too. But still I like to work a diff line of fish each time. For example, I could have asked Derrick for a lovely pair of Totoro blacks and pay him at whatever price he is comfortable, but isnt it more fun to work a line yrself and see if it can better totoro eventually?

[Myron Tay]

Kelvin

Improving standards is one thing, obtaining world class fishes is another. I do not believe that the efforts of White Aquarium would alone be enough to enable all of us to produce world class fish. In light of your question, I ask this: My fren has bought fish from White Aquarium, but why his fish still not world class?

I believe White Aquarium and BCS can co-exist and play important roles in fostering the kind of culture that would enable all of us to produce world class fish. Joining BCS is one thing, but on top of that, I think this hobby takes a lot of effort, hard work, experience, friendly competition and learning from others to be able to achieve the kind of fish that we all hope to see produced in Singapore. I believe that the fruits of the labour of some of the fishes produced by BCS members speak for themselves. And most of them would attribute some part of their success to BCS.

I do not have world class fishes yet but I am willing to put in the effort, hard work, learning to breed this wonderful fish and enter fishes to engage in friendly competition. And I believe that BCS provides the best platform in Singapore to enable me to do so. Owning a HM is not nearly as satisfying as seeing a HM in your own spawn. [^]That has been my experience.

quote:Originally posted by Kelvin Tan

basically my questions and those i posted in the other post, is what a non member would immediately think of when i read yr post.
'things like hey, how come my fren join but his fish still not world class'
'join already then singapore betta become world class?" etc etc
thats why... not against you. its how a 'outsider' would look.

actually i think White Aquarium has done more for singapore betta in improving standards by selling quality fish at low low prices. see almost all those interested in HM has owned a HM.

[Kelvin Tan]

actually i am not exactly desperately looking to outcross my fish, in fact its about time i inbreed them. anyway as i mention in another post, i believe committee member playing a stronger role in forums making frens would be nice. cos as f hong mention, etc etc has his line of fish and you can tell most are from the committee, and it has always appeared that its a closed circle committee members (if you understand what i mean) as i said if a ntu guy manage to joint venture with example, edwin, he would be very happy and proud of it and his group of betta kakis would be impressed upon as well. this is what steven has been trying to bring across too, trying to bring together all the groups of betta kakis together. some joint venture might already be done but i dun anyone within my frens who are la.

and last but not least, we must also shows respect to other forum, and not think that bcs is the best betta forum. (two examples so far, doesnt make bcs look nice, and when ppl reads it, makes ppl think bcs is proud)

[Kelvin Tan]

actually i am not exactly desperately looking to outcross my fish, in fact its about time i inbreed them. anyway as i mention in another post, i believe committee member playing a stronger role in forums making frens would be nice. cos as f hong mention, etc etc has his line of fish and you can tell most are from the committee, and it has always appeared that its a closed circle committee members (if you understand what i mean) as i said if a ntu guy manage to joint venture with example, edwin, he would be very happy and proud of it and his group of betta kakis would be impressed upon as well. this is what steven has been trying to bring across too, trying to bring together all the groups of betta kakis together. some joint venture might already be done but i dun anyone within my frens who are la.

and last but not least, we must also shows respect to other forum, and not think that bcs is the best betta forum. (two examples so far, doesnt make bcs look nice, and when ppl reads it, makes ppl think bcs is proud)

[Foo Hong]

Not closed-door committee but surely the BCS comm is a close knitted committee. We work very closely together and thats why in the cos of BCS events, other things are shared. By nature, most club committees would be a close bunch cos otherwise how will we be able to work as a club comm. When u see each other, know each other, thgs are easier. When people dont turn up at club gathering, what can we do? The comm is not only close amongst themselves and restrict to within. We do mix around with other mbrs as well.

Similarly, those Betta NTU and Arof or bettahan etc would also have their small group of friends. Steven wants to bring together all factions, but this will only succeed if all sources share a common n undivided vision, instead of adopting a comparing/commenting attitude and bringing in topics which could stir unhappiness,eg. $60/ $30 issue which pops up every now and then.

I have never spoken that BCS is best forum on other forums, altho that is the image we always aim to project. We aim that BCS will be the best forum, for betta matters,not just jokes or humour or selling bettas like some classified ads site . There is no need to tell people whether u are best forum or not cos people have eyes/ears and can see for themselves. If people want to imagine BCS as proud, for whatever reason,its up to them and I personally am not too concerned. Like Dr Kenny Poh, I spoke recently on bettahan to rebutt unfair comments made on an old retiree, not simply bcos I like talking there, but to speak up for someone who probably received 3rd degree shock from replies received and was too stunt to respond. We need to respect others before we ask that people respect ourselves. Just bcos another party is different doesnt mean he is an asshole. Otherwise, we will end up like Singapore/Malaysia bilateral discussions.

We have just opened up the forum to teh public and I dont think this is the type of subject they want to read. if u have any further queries, its best you sent me a PM.

[Foo Hong]

Not closed-door committee but surely the BCS comm is a close knitted committee. We work very closely together and thats why in the cos of BCS events, other things are shared. By nature, most club committees would be a close bunch cos otherwise how will we be able to work as a club comm. When u see each other, know each other, thgs are easier. When people dont turn up at club gathering, what can we do? The comm is not only close amongst themselves and restrict to within. We do mix around with other mbrs as well.

Similarly, those Betta NTU and Arof or bettahan etc would also have their small group of friends. Steven wants to bring together all factions, but this will only succeed if all sources share a common n undivided vision, instead of adopting a comparing/commenting attitude and bringing in topics which could stir unhappiness,eg. $60/ $30 issue which pops up every now and then.

I have never spoken that BCS is best forum on other forums, altho that is the image we always aim to project. We aim that BCS will be the best forum, for betta matters,not just jokes or humour or selling bettas like some classified ads site . There is no need to tell people whether u are best forum or not cos people have eyes/ears and can see for themselves. If people want to imagine BCS as proud, for whatever reason,its up to them and I personally am not too concerned. Like Dr Kenny Poh, I spoke recently on bettahan to rebutt unfair comments made on an old retiree, not simply bcos I like talking there, but to speak up for someone who probably received 3rd degree shock from replies received and was too stunt to respond. We need to respect others before we ask that people respect ourselves. Just bcos another party is different doesnt mean he is an asshole. Otherwise, we will end up like Singapore/Malaysia bilateral discussions.

We have just opened up the forum to teh public and I dont think this is the type of subject they want to read. if u have any further queries, its best you sent me a PM.

[Chris Yew]

Reminder - the first 2 Forum Topic is not available to the Public! But since these is getting out of topic on Why should I join BCS, I think it's better for parties involved to carry on via PM or Email.

Chatroom will be available in future if I'm able to do that damn mod.[^]

quote:Originally posted by Foo Hong

Not closed-door committee but surely the BCS comm is a close knitted committee. We work very closely together and thats why in the cos of BCS events, other things are shared. By nature, most club committees would be a close bunch cos otherwise how will we be able to work as a club comm. When u see each other, know each other, thgs are easier. When people dont turn up at club gathering, what can we do? The comm is not only close amongst themselves and restrict to within. We do mix around with other mbrs as well.

Similarly, those Betta NTU and Arof or bettahan etc would also have their small group of friends. Steven wants to bring together all factions, but this will only succeed if all sources share a common n undivided vision, instead of adopting a comparing/commenting attitude and bringing in topics which could stir unhappiness,eg. $60/ $30 issue which pops up every now and then.

I have never spoken that BCS is best forum on other forums, altho that is the image we always aim to project. We aim that BCS will be the best forum, for betta matters,not just jokes or humour or selling bettas like some classified ads site . There is no need to tell people whether u are best forum or not cos people have eyes/ears and can see for themselves. If people want to imagine BCS as proud, for whatever reason,its up to them and I personally am not too concerned. Like Dr Kenny Poh, I spoke recently on bettahan to rebutt unfair comments made on an old retiree, not simply bcos I like talking there, but to speak up for someone who probably received 3rd degree shock from replies received and was too stunt to respond. We need to respect others before we ask that people respect ourselves. Just bcos another party is different doesnt mean he is an asshole. Otherwise, we will end up like Singapore/Malaysia bilateral discussions.

We have just opened up the forum to teh public and I dont think this is the type of subject they want to read. if u have any further queries, its best you sent me a PM.

[Chris Yew]

Reminder - the first 2 Forum Topic is not available to the Public! But since these is getting out of topic on Why should I join BCS, I think it's better for parties involved to carry on via PM or Email.

Chatroom will be available in future if I'm able to do that damn mod.[^]

quote:Originally posted by Foo Hong

Not closed-door committee but surely the BCS comm is a close knitted committee. We work very closely together and thats why in the cos of BCS events, other things are shared. By nature, most club committees would be a close bunch cos otherwise how will we be able to work as a club comm. When u see each other, know each other, thgs are easier. When people dont turn up at club gathering, what can we do? The comm is not only close amongst themselves and restrict to within. We do mix around with other mbrs as well.

Similarly, those Betta NTU and Arof or bettahan etc would also have their small group of friends. Steven wants to bring together all factions, but this will only succeed if all sources share a common n undivided vision, instead of adopting a comparing/commenting attitude and bringing in topics which could stir unhappiness,eg. $60/ $30 issue which pops up every now and then.

I have never spoken that BCS is best forum on other forums, altho that is the image we always aim to project. We aim that BCS will be the best forum, for betta matters,not just jokes or humour or selling bettas like some classified ads site . There is no need to tell people whether u are best forum or not cos people have eyes/ears and can see for themselves. If people want to imagine BCS as proud, for whatever reason,its up to them and I personally am not too concerned. Like Dr Kenny Poh, I spoke recently on bettahan to rebutt unfair comments made on an old retiree, not simply bcos I like talking there, but to speak up for someone who probably received 3rd degree shock from replies received and was too stunt to respond. We need to respect others before we ask that people respect ourselves. Just bcos another party is different doesnt mean he is an asshole. Otherwise, we will end up like Singapore/Malaysia bilateral discussions.

We have just opened up the forum to teh public and I dont think this is the type of subject they want to read. if u have any further queries, its best you sent me a PM.

[Kelvin Tan]

i'm posting based on what ppl feel about bcs.

as i said, perhaps someone should come up with set of questionaire with anonymousity to find out real opinion of ppl towards bcs.

bettahan and arofanatics has been called childish and nonsensical by two committee members. how would someone feel when they read that?

money is always and will be an issue in membership fees, dun you think?

if i dun care about bcs why should i bother to argue here?

[Kelvin Tan]

i'm posting based on what ppl feel about bcs.

as i said, perhaps someone should come up with set of questionaire with anonymousity to find out real opinion of ppl towards bcs.

bettahan and arofanatics has been called childish and nonsensical by two committee members. how would someone feel when they read that?

money is always and will be an issue in membership fees, dun you think?

if i dun care about bcs why should i bother to argue here?

[Chris Yew]

As I've mentioned earlier, these are getting out of topic and I dun wish to have these carry on. Parties who wish to carry on such discussion, pls do so via PM or Email.

quote:Originally posted by Kelvin Tan

i'm posting based on what ppl feel about bcs.

as i said, perhaps someone should come up with set of questionaire with anonymousity to find out real opinion of ppl towards bcs.

bettahan and arofanatics has been called childish and nonsensical by two committee members. how would someone feel when they read that?

money is always and will be an issue in membership fees, dun you think?

if i dun care about bcs why should i bother to argue here?

[Chris Yew]

As I've mentioned earlier, these are getting out of topic and I dun wish to have these carry on. Parties who wish to carry on such discussion, pls do so via PM or Email.

quote:Originally posted by Kelvin Tan

i'm posting based on what ppl feel about bcs.

as i said, perhaps someone should come up with set of questionaire with anonymousity to find out real opinion of ppl towards bcs.

bettahan and arofanatics has been called childish and nonsensical by two committee members. how would someone feel when they read that?

money is always and will be an issue in membership fees, dun you think?

if i dun care about bcs why should i bother to argue here?

[kennho]

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[kennho]

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[Chris Yew]

I think I have to put a stop to this thread and will suggest you guys carry on via PM or Email. I don't mind starting a new thread on these issues.

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[Chris Yew]

I think I have to put a stop to this thread and will suggest you guys carry on via PM or Email. I don't mind starting a new thread on these issues.

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[Foo Hong]

Agree to close.

quote:Originally posted by Chris Yew

I think I have to put a stop to this thread and will suggest you guys carry on via PM or Email. I don't mind starting a new thread on these issues.

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[Foo Hong]

Agree to close.

quote:Originally posted by Chris Yew

I think I have to put a stop to this thread and will suggest you guys carry on via PM or Email. I don't mind starting a new thread on these issues.

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Why is money always a problem ? Don't you know that there are local clubs' annual fee at $120 ? And I knew that a group of them are members to 2-3 clubs with annual fee of over 500 bucks a year. A few of them I knew are students and there is no discount or whatsoever.

Why not join the committee lah and really know what's going on inside.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

pls. move this to the right thread for the following:

It's aleady June now... BCS has not officially post out it's one year event. How will people join BCS when they don't know whats going on in BCS? We want BCS to organise more Comp. by itself , not just giving support to LFS comp.

We want to see better plannings yearly base, not last minute like... LFS have a comp. .. lets have a BCS fair.thingly..

The list can go on....
Malcom

I believe this discussion fits into this thread quite well. Some have already expressed their views and I would do mine.

Membership entails with it a level of commitment. The organisation of events should not rest entirely on the shoulders of a select group of members of any organisation (such as the committee) but also to each and every member. The reason why we do not have such a vibrant BCS scene in Singapore is down to the assumption that the committee should be the one to organise all events, with the rest of the members joining in to help where and when they can. This should ideally not be the case, since shows a lack of commitment on the part of members.

I am not part of the committee but I work closely with them in organising events. Ask anyone who has done the organisation of competitions before: it is tough work, bearing in mind that no one is paid by the club to organise such events. My view is that we have a team of very dedicated but very tired committee members. Believe that they would willing give up their unenviable position to anyone who thinks they can do a better job.

At this junction, most of us might be thinking "Why have a club then?" Let's us bear in mind the genesis of the club: we wanted to organise our efforts and promote betta appreciation as a hobby. Just one benchmark: Prior to BCS, there were no betta competitions in Singapore. After BCS, other than isolated one or two with commercial intent and interest rather than solely from a promotion of betta appreciation per say, there has been no betta competition held in Singapore in which BCS has not been involved in (in one form or other).

I sincerely do not think that it is fair for one to enjoy the benefits of BCS-organised events without any support to BCS in terms of resources (funds and manpower) required to organise such events.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

pls. move this to the right thread for the following:

It's aleady June now... BCS has not officially post out it's one year event. How will people join BCS when they don't know whats going on in BCS? We want BCS to organise more Comp. by itself , not just giving support to LFS comp.

We want to see better plannings yearly base, not last minute like... LFS have a comp. .. lets have a BCS fair.thingly..

The list can go on....
Malcom

I believe this discussion fits into this thread quite well. Some have already expressed their views and I would do mine.

Membership entails with it a level of commitment. The organisation of events should not rest entirely on the shoulders of a select group of members of any organisation (such as the committee) but also to each and every member. The reason why we do not have such a vibrant BCS scene in Singapore is down to the assumption that the committee should be the one to organise all events, with the rest of the members joining in to help where and when they can. This should ideally not be the case, since shows a lack of commitment on the part of members.

I am not part of the committee but I work closely with them in organising events. Ask anyone who has done the organisation of competitions before: it is tough work, bearing in mind that no one is paid by the club to organise such events. My view is that we have a team of very dedicated but very tired committee members. Believe that they would willing give up their unenviable position to anyone who thinks they can do a better job.

At this junction, most of us might be thinking "Why have a club then?" Let's us bear in mind the genesis of the club: we wanted to organise our efforts and promote betta appreciation as a hobby. Just one benchmark: Prior to BCS, there were no betta competitions in Singapore. After BCS, other than isolated one or two with commercial intent and interest rather than solely from a promotion of betta appreciation per say, there has been no betta competition held in Singapore in which BCS has not been involved in (in one form or other).

I sincerely do not think that it is fair for one to enjoy the benefits of BCS-organised events without any support to BCS in terms of resources (funds and manpower) required to organise such events.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

why was the betta fair not annouced at the beginning of the year?? Who will knows the effort put in by the few good guys left?? I respected them for that.
I'm speaking from an outsider point of view, even tho' I'm a BCS member. Show us the dates for the whole year. We can't see it if it is not annouced . We can't commit & sign up if we can't see the justification.
Malcom

We have shifted the discussion here. See my points above.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

why was the betta fair not annouced at the beginning of the year?? Who will knows the effort put in by the few good guys left?? I respected them for that.
I'm speaking from an outsider point of view, even tho' I'm a BCS member. Show us the dates for the whole year. We can't see it if it is not annouced . We can't commit & sign up if we can't see the justification.
Malcom

We have shifted the discussion here. See my points above.

[Phil]

Myron well said. I believe we join the BCS more because of our passion for the bettas rather than what the BCS can do for us. We are all one for the promotion of bettas. We each take pride in breeding our own special strains in the process,always seeking to better what we have. Our commitments is not to the $ and cents, although this does help in sustaining our hobby, but I believe that on the average we tend to spend more than what we can profit from betta sales.

Malcom I do know you to be very dedicated to your bettas and you are indeed one of the few that would go for the best. The club needs people like yourself to help promote the hobby and improving existing strains. I am sure you do have ideas of your own on how the club should be managged and improved. Such imputs would greatly benefit the club and you are welcome to take a more active role (I have been hounding you on this!)to make OUR BCS a much better club. The committee is trying to organise events, let us all do our own little part in helping to make OUR BCS a much better club. One that we can all be proud to associate with. Time for us to reverse the issue and ask ourselves what would make us proud to be a BCS member and what can we do for the club to make it an icon in the bettta world? Do provide indepth suggestions so that the BCS committee can ponder on the issues. I am sure that they are more than willing to welcome you to share your thoughts and recommendations.

cheers.


quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

pls. move this to the right thread for the following:

It's aleady June now... BCS has not officially post out it's one year event. How will people join BCS when they don't know whats going on in BCS? We want BCS to organise more Comp. by itself , not just giving support to LFS comp.

We want to see better plannings yearly base, not last minute like... LFS have a comp. .. lets have a BCS fair.thingly..

The list can go on....
Malcom

I believe this discussion fits into this thread quite well. Some have already expressed their views and I would do mine.

Membership entails with it a level of commitment. The organisation of events should not rest entirely on the shoulders of a select group of members of any organisation (such as the committee) but also to each and every member. The reason why we do not have such a vibrant BCS scene in Singapore is down to the assumption that the committee should be the one to organise all events, with the rest of the members joining in to help where and when they can. This should ideally not be the case, since shows a lack of commitment on the part of members.

I am not part of the committee but I work closely with them in organising events. Ask anyone who has done the organisation of competitions before: it is tough work, bearing in mind that no one is paid by the club to organise such events. My view is that we have a team of very dedicated but very tired committee members. Believe that they would willing give up their unenviable position to anyone who thinks they can do a better job.

At this junction, most of us might be thinking "Why have a club then?" Let's us bear in mind the genesis of the club: we wanted to organise our efforts and promote betta appreciation as a hobby. Just one benchmark: Prior to BCS, there were no betta competitions in Singapore. After BCS, other than isolated one or two with commercial intent and interest rather than solely from a promotion of betta appreciation per say, there has been no betta competition held in Singapore in which BCS has not been involved in (in one form or other).

I sincerely do not think that it is fair for one to enjoy the benefits of BCS-organised events without any support to BCS in terms of resources (funds and manpower) required to organise such events.

[Phil]

Myron well said. I believe we join the BCS more because of our passion for the bettas rather than what the BCS can do for us. We are all one for the promotion of bettas. We each take pride in breeding our own special strains in the process,always seeking to better what we have. Our commitments is not to the $ and cents, although this does help in sustaining our hobby, but I believe that on the average we tend to spend more than what we can profit from betta sales.

Malcom I do know you to be very dedicated to your bettas and you are indeed one of the few that would go for the best. The club needs people like yourself to help promote the hobby and improving existing strains. I am sure you do have ideas of your own on how the club should be managged and improved. Such imputs would greatly benefit the club and you are welcome to take a more active role (I have been hounding you on this!)to make OUR BCS a much better club. The committee is trying to organise events, let us all do our own little part in helping to make OUR BCS a much better club. One that we can all be proud to associate with. Time for us to reverse the issue and ask ourselves what would make us proud to be a BCS member and what can we do for the club to make it an icon in the bettta world? Do provide indepth suggestions so that the BCS committee can ponder on the issues. I am sure that they are more than willing to welcome you to share your thoughts and recommendations.

cheers.


quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

quote:Originally posted by Malcom Tan

pls. move this to the right thread for the following:

It's aleady June now... BCS has not officially post out it's one year event. How will people join BCS when they don't know whats going on in BCS? We want BCS to organise more Comp. by itself , not just giving support to LFS comp.

We want to see better plannings yearly base, not last minute like... LFS have a comp. .. lets have a BCS fair.thingly..

The list can go on....
Malcom

I believe this discussion fits into this thread quite well. Some have already expressed their views and I would do mine.

Membership entails with it a level of commitment. The organisation of events should not rest entirely on the shoulders of a select group of members of any organisation (such as the committee) but also to each and every member. The reason why we do not have such a vibrant BCS scene in Singapore is down to the assumption that the committee should be the one to organise all events, with the rest of the members joining in to help where and when they can. This should ideally not be the case, since shows a lack of commitment on the part of members.

I am not part of the committee but I work closely with them in organising events. Ask anyone who has done the organisation of competitions before: it is tough work, bearing in mind that no one is paid by the club to organise such events. My view is that we have a team of very dedicated but very tired committee members. Believe that they would willing give up their unenviable position to anyone who thinks they can do a better job.

At this junction, most of us might be thinking "Why have a club then?" Let's us bear in mind the genesis of the club: we wanted to organise our efforts and promote betta appreciation as a hobby. Just one benchmark: Prior to BCS, there were no betta competitions in Singapore. After BCS, other than isolated one or two with commercial intent and interest rather than solely from a promotion of betta appreciation per say, there has been no betta competition held in Singapore in which BCS has not been involved in (in one form or other).

I sincerely do not think that it is fair for one to enjoy the benefits of BCS-organised events without any support to BCS in terms of resources (funds and manpower) required to organise such events.

[Simon Tan]

HI Kelvin, sometime I feel like quitting BCS. I'm a member since it started. I joined because I like Betta. I just paid the $60 with asking any question. After 6 mth, never hear from any comm. member until I meet Edwin. He explained what went wrong during the set-up of BCS. Now I am fully involved with the Club, giving my time to help in orginising, setting up racks, clearing up racks during road shows and competitions. But I always see the same delicated members (young & old) helping out. I feel good about it to see such member helping out.We needs ppl to come forward and help the Club. The Club resources and finanical are limitied but the club is still doing a great job.
Let make BCS a place to enjoy our hobby of keeping Bettas.

[Simon Tan]

HI Kelvin, sometime I feel like quitting BCS. I'm a member since it started. I joined because I like Betta. I just paid the $60 with asking any question. After 6 mth, never hear from any comm. member until I meet Edwin. He explained what went wrong during the set-up of BCS. Now I am fully involved with the Club, giving my time to help in orginising, setting up racks, clearing up racks during road shows and competitions. But I always see the same delicated members (young & old) helping out. I feel good about it to see such member helping out.We needs ppl to come forward and help the Club. The Club resources and finanical are limitied but the club is still doing a great job.
Let make BCS a place to enjoy our hobby of keeping Bettas.

[KY Foong]

Unless we have a club it will be hard to speak with one voice. We are young as a club. I joined BCS also without much hesitation. It was in the "open house" at Seletar Farm. It is better that we ask all hobbyist one simple question. What part do you think you can contribute to enhancing the hobby. I also remember that the comm members do not have any financial gains, in fact, as a comm member we are expected to be the first to buy any promotion item. We enjoy the hobby and try to make it more enjoyable to more people.

[KY Foong]

Unless we have a club it will be hard to speak with one voice. We are young as a club. I joined BCS also without much hesitation. It was in the "open house" at Seletar Farm. It is better that we ask all hobbyist one simple question. What part do you think you can contribute to enhancing the hobby. I also remember that the comm members do not have any financial gains, in fact, as a comm member we are expected to be the first to buy any promotion item. We enjoy the hobby and try to make it more enjoyable to more people.

[Sebas]

Hi! Its me! Anyway, the club is there because its set up by a group of hobbyists that loved bettas even before many of us know that there is such a thing as show betta breeding. I love BCS because there are so many different people from all walks of life and all of them come together to form the club because of one fact.......All of them love bettas. So the people makes the club and not the club that makes the people. If one wants the club to organize more, do more, plan more, he or she should then participate in the club and get it moving because he or she is also part of the club.

Kae

[Sebas]

Hi! Its me! Anyway, the club is there because its set up by a group of hobbyists that loved bettas even before many of us know that there is such a thing as show betta breeding. I love BCS because there are so many different people from all walks of life and all of them come together to form the club because of one fact.......All of them love bettas. So the people makes the club and not the club that makes the people. If one wants the club to organize more, do more, plan more, he or she should then participate in the club and get it moving because he or she is also part of the club.

Kae

[Myron Tay]

Noticed what happened when the BCS committee took a break? Yes, no major betta related activities happened. This is a preview of what it would be like if BCS does not exist. And BCS will not exist if there are no members. So if you like to see some form of betta scene here in Singapore, you should have no qualms joining BCS.

[roycheok]

Hey...I am still a member (since it's inception)till now and I do not
even have any bettas now!!! (ok ok...got 1 pair, but for a long time, no bettas). What does that say?

I am still a member of the club...not because of the fish. It's the company of the BCS members that I enjoy...the fishes are just for fighting!!!! haha

[KY Foong]

I have been an non active member and now a little more active than before. I like to see the hobby and the bobbyist have a voice and welfare. For example, there want to organize a betta show/competition in China, they contacted BCS. The Malaysian side also contacted us for participation and discussion. By welfare, I mean we can be represented. More people are aware, more into this hobby, more fun, more challenges, higher quality fish at lower price (oops...on price again).

[Wayne]

Just read the thread title "How to renew membership"..found the link to the BCS application form. I was thinking, well why not join BCS, because I really enjoy to be here, it is fun and informative. And I certainly wanted to visit SG if BCS is organising any competition/show/fair. So i go ahead and download the form, downloaded and open up the form, looking at the fees section, "Ordinary Membership"...hmm..may be..since i really looks ordinary. "Senior Citizens" (60 yrs and above) ...I am too young. Nope. Student Membership ..... slightly too old for that and not from SG. Nope. "Foreign Membership" ... Ah ha, looks more like it, Entrance fees SGD100.[pw] Yikes!![bh] Can't afford. [bt] Not really can't afford lah, you can call me "kiam siap", but, SGD100 is really RM200+. [xx(] Can Malaysian apply under as "Ordinary Membership" ah? :D

May be next time when my wallet is fuller. [pf]

[imported_n/a]

erm..may i know where to download the form ?

[Wayne]

Yishu, try here http://www.bettaclub.org.sg/forum/portal.asp?ContentID=18&CategoryID=4

[Alvin Lim]

This thread has been around for quite awhile, so forgive me if I am repeating some things that have already been said.

Have been a member for nearly a year. I am more of a lurker [8D]
than a poster. My grand dad and father was heavy into FIGHTING fish decades ago and I got bitten by the betta bug in last year's Aquarama after about 20 years break from FIGHTING fish.

I paid the $60x2 (my wife and me) to contribute to the efforts of BCS. For me, getting my 1st good advice from the forum would have earned back the membership fee.

After lurking the other forums, BCS seems like a "gentlemen's" (and ladies also) forum as compare to the "Kiddy" forums. But if we are not careful, it may turn into an "old men's" forum.

From a membership size perspective, there are not many people that can be successful breeders. We also need to concentrate on people who just want to appreciate the 1 or 2 betta for display purposes. I realise that HMs and CTs are difficult to maintain that is why many beginners are turning back to plakats.

For activities especially competitions, I realize just having 3 months notice is not easy for a HDB based breeder to spawn and prepare competition candidates. Having a full year calender would help a lot to us small timers.

Given we are depending on the goodness of our fellow members to manage club activities, I am satisfied that a few small achievable goals be met each year and the club evolves slowly. We are here for the long haul anyway. For example, a year-end annual competition, a mid year meet/compare, a online photo comp and sprinkle of member house visits. Hey, I am happy already.[:P]

Cheers! [ber]