Caudal Rays Snapping / Broken Rays

[Myron Tay]

Anyone has problems with weak caudal rays. Beginning to suspect that there is a deficiency in the diet. Anyone can advise what the problem is?

[Foo Hong]

Not sure but could be due to handling.

[Foo Hong]

Not sure but could be due to handling.

[Jonathan_Tan]

could it be a calcium deficientcy?
if i'm not wrong, the rays are part of the fish's bone structure and so it could break. weak cos lack of calcium thats y degenerate and break over time.
got a red that has this problem. the first few rays on his caudal curled.
thats what i think.

[Jonathan_Tan]

could it be a calcium deficientcy?
if i'm not wrong, the rays are part of the fish's bone structure and so it could break. weak cos lack of calcium thats y degenerate and break over time.
got a red that has this problem. the first few rays on his caudal curled.
thats what i think.

[kennho]

Lack of Folic Acid.

[kennho]

Lack of Folic Acid.

[Foo Hong]

I just got a turquoise young HM back from KL. he snapped one of his dorsal rays. bettas do end up breaking them if excessively stressed physically.

[Foo Hong]

I just got a turquoise young HM back from KL. he snapped one of his dorsal rays. bettas do end up breaking them if excessively stressed physically.

[Myron Tay]

How to improve the situation? What should we feed to overcome the deficiency?

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Lack of Folic Acid.

[Myron Tay]

How to improve the situation? What should we feed to overcome the deficiency?

quote:Originally posted by kennho

Lack of Folic Acid.

[kennho]

I am not too sure how others are working on the diet, but the varieties I am giving are quite broad range. Special pork/prawn/spirulina high protein mix as main diet, live tbw, frozen bw, grounded tetrabites(high protein) and Momizi Tropical dried feed. There are a lot of studies on fish diet requirement and easily found that all fishes required a wide range of minerals and essential fats. Problem is that there isn't any studies on aquatic fish diet requirement, not commercially viable I guess. The only few studies I could use is the goldfish and koi, probably due to the large base hobbyist groups around the world.

In fact, pure feeding on tbw, frozen bw will not provide the enough nutrients and minerals. Bloodworms contain about 9% dry matter and of this about 65% is crude protein, 10% is crude fat and about 10% is ash. They contain 15% Nitrogen free extract. They are also a good source of iron for fish since they contain hemoglobin in their blood.

Simply use bloodworms as supplement and fill the rest with natural or commercial products.

[kennho]

I am not too sure how others are working on the diet, but the varieties I am giving are quite broad range. Special pork/prawn/spirulina high protein mix as main diet, live tbw, frozen bw, grounded tetrabites(high protein) and Momizi Tropical dried feed. There are a lot of studies on fish diet requirement and easily found that all fishes required a wide range of minerals and essential fats. Problem is that there isn't any studies on aquatic fish diet requirement, not commercially viable I guess. The only few studies I could use is the goldfish and koi, probably due to the large base hobbyist groups around the world.

In fact, pure feeding on tbw, frozen bw will not provide the enough nutrients and minerals. Bloodworms contain about 9% dry matter and of this about 65% is crude protein, 10% is crude fat and about 10% is ash. They contain 15% Nitrogen free extract. They are also a good source of iron for fish since they contain hemoglobin in their blood.

Simply use bloodworms as supplement and fill the rest with natural or commercial products.

[Foo Hong]

In a Koi book, it states that it is possible to raise koi on pellets which are balanced. thats why Koi grew so big on them, altho they also mentioned aditional stuffs like bread which is rich in wheatgerm, BWs in iron, fruits like water melon, carrots etc rich in carotene.

[Foo Hong]

In a Koi book, it states that it is possible to raise koi on pellets which are balanced. thats why Koi grew so big on them, altho they also mentioned aditional stuffs like bread which is rich in wheatgerm, BWs in iron, fruits like water melon, carrots etc rich in carotene.

[Phil]

I share Foo Hong's observation. In my most cases it has been due to poor handling. I have seen my HMs with 180 degrees finnage looking very good one day and having a snapped caudal the very next day. It usually happens after a water change and of course my workers get fired for it. I hope you are not using a net to catch your bettas. This has been one of the biggest culprit to snap Caudals. Better to use a container to scoop up fish and some water than even to use your hands. Its gentler on the fish. Hope this helps

[Phil]

I share Foo Hong's observation. In my most cases it has been due to poor handling. I have seen my HMs with 180 degrees finnage looking very good one day and having a snapped caudal the very next day. It usually happens after a water change and of course my workers get fired for it. I hope you are not using a net to catch your bettas. This has been one of the biggest culprit to snap Caudals. Better to use a container to scoop up fish and some water than even to use your hands. Its gentler on the fish. Hope this helps

[Myron Tay]

Nope, not the net. Only use nets for the females. Maybe it occurred during the water change (when the fish is flip flopping in the container). Have since switched to partial water changes and have not had any problems since...

[Myron Tay]

Nope, not the net. Only use nets for the females. Maybe it occurred during the water change (when the fish is flip flopping in the container). Have since switched to partial water changes and have not had any problems since...

[Steven Cheng]

Has anyone seen how Straits aquariums change water for their fish in the plastic containers? They just pour all the water out and hold the fish in a cupped palm, then scoop water with the container in the other hand and dump the fish back into it. It scare the hell out of me, and my 8 year-old boy was so shock at what he saw, he shouted:"..... how can they change water like this???" I have become a bit more rough to my fish since then. I think the outcome was not much different for my case, some get snapped fin rays, some don't. Still searching for the answer and solution.

[Steven Cheng]

Has anyone seen how Straits aquariums change water for their fish in the plastic containers? They just pour all the water out and hold the fish in a cupped palm, then scoop water with the container in the other hand and dump the fish back into it. It scare the hell out of me, and my 8 year-old boy was so shock at what he saw, he shouted:"..... how can they change water like this???" I have become a bit more rough to my fish since then. I think the outcome was not much different for my case, some get snapped fin rays, some don't. Still searching for the answer and solution.

[Foo Hong]

Henry Yin uses a cup to scoop his competitive CTs during water change, never a net or hand. A few times I used my hand and my nails cut the finnage :(.

If you change regularly and use a large volume, water changes need not be 100% everytime.

[Foo Hong]

Henry Yin uses a cup to scoop his competitive CTs during water change, never a net or hand. A few times I used my hand and my nails cut the finnage :(.

If you change regularly and use a large volume, water changes need not be 100% everytime.

[kennho]

I don't think we can compare the dietary requirement of both koi and goldfish as they have years of studies put onto the food and water condition. The fact that these 2 fishes required a big quantity of protein enriched food with the use of wheat flour(13% protein), wheat germ(5-6%), spirulina( 57%), prawn/shrimp (20%). No matter what food, you will notice the use of soybean which is one of the important food for Folate. Another important factor is the amount of space these 2 fishes required, same as an arowana. One travel to China and see how breeders' farm work on their pond and diet will understand.

A poor or restricted diet will cause deficiencies in fish growth, coloration, health and finnage. Of course, I don't disagree on handling as I am very particular on how I catch my goldfish. But too bad, betta wise, I do what Straits is doing. :)

[kennho]

I don't think we can compare the dietary requirement of both koi and goldfish as they have years of studies put onto the food and water condition. The fact that these 2 fishes required a big quantity of protein enriched food with the use of wheat flour(13% protein), wheat germ(5-6%), spirulina( 57%), prawn/shrimp (20%). No matter what food, you will notice the use of soybean which is one of the important food for Folate. Another important factor is the amount of space these 2 fishes required, same as an arowana. One travel to China and see how breeders' farm work on their pond and diet will understand.

A poor or restricted diet will cause deficiencies in fish growth, coloration, health and finnage. Of course, I don't disagree on handling as I am very particular on how I catch my goldfish. But too bad, betta wise, I do what Straits is doing. :)

[Phil]

Please note that this priviledge treatment of scooping up the fish with a container is only meant for your competition bettas and those with potentials. It is really a tedious process as care has to be taken to ensure that you don't damage the fish at all. Definitely not recommended if you are changing water for some 300 bettas or more.

[Phil]

Please note that this priviledge treatment of scooping up the fish with a container is only meant for your competition bettas and those with potentials. It is really a tedious process as care has to be taken to ensure that you don't damage the fish at all. Definitely not recommended if you are changing water for some 300 bettas or more.

[Myron Tay]

I have concluded that it is definitely due to a deficiency in the diet that was my problem. Have no problems with caudal fins snapping after supplementing the diet of my reds.

[Myron Tay]

I have concluded that it is definitely due to a deficiency in the diet that was my problem. Have no problems with caudal fins snapping after supplementing the diet of my reds.

[kennho]

Myron, what have u done to the diet ?

[kennho]

Myron, what have u done to the diet ?

[Myron Tay]

Supplemented the diet of my fish with dried foods. Momizi brand.

[Myron Tay]

Supplemented the diet of my fish with dried foods. Momizi brand.

[kennho]

Momizi Tropical or Momizi Pro ? Anyway, good choice. once a day ? Rays thicken/strengthen ? color wise leh ?

[kennho]

Momizi Tropical or Momizi Pro ? Anyway, good choice. once a day ? Rays thicken/strengthen ? color wise leh ?

[Myron Tay]

Momizi Tropical. Dietary supplement only. As a snack in between their meals of frozen bloodworms and frozen brine shrimp. As and when I am free. Not sure about the thickness of rays but no more breakages. As for colour, look at my photo album. :D

[Myron Tay]

Momizi Tropical. Dietary supplement only. As a snack in between their meals of frozen bloodworms and frozen brine shrimp. As and when I am free. Not sure about the thickness of rays but no more breakages. As for colour, look at my photo album. :D

[kennho]

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

Momizi Tropical. Dietary supplement only. As a snack in between their meals of frozen bloodworms and frozen daphnia. As and when I am free. Not sure about the thickness of rays but no more breakages. As for colour, look at my photo album. :D


aiyo, color refer to any significant change in color compare to those did not feed with momizi. [bt]

[kennho]

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

Momizi Tropical. Dietary supplement only. As a snack in between their meals of frozen bloodworms and frozen daphnia. As and when I am free. Not sure about the thickness of rays but no more breakages. As for colour, look at my photo album. :D


aiyo, color refer to any significant change in color compare to those did not feed with momizi. [bt]

[Myron Tay]

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D

quote:

aiyo, color refer to any significant change in color compare to those did not feed with momizi. [bt]

[Myron Tay]

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D

quote:

aiyo, color refer to any significant change in color compare to those did not feed with momizi. [bt]

[Ong Ginyew]

how does a caudal fin snapping looked liked??

[Ong Ginyew]

how does a caudal fin snapping looked liked??

[kennho]

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D


Wah piang, owner can't tell, and dun expect me to tell using pics leh. [ass][be]:D

which pic is before, which after ?

[kennho]

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D


Wah piang, owner can't tell, and dun expect me to tell using pics leh. [ass][be]:D

which pic is before, which after ?

[Myron Tay]

Only first pic (outcurling rays) is before. The rest after. That alone probably says something in itself? :D

quote:Originally posted by kennho

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D


Wah piang, owner can't tell, and dun expect me to tell using pics leh. [ass][be]:D

which pic is before, which after ?

[Myron Tay]

Only first pic (outcurling rays) is before. The rest after. That alone probably says something in itself? :D

quote:Originally posted by kennho

quote:Originally posted by Myron Tay

I know. Can't really tell myself. You look at the fish in my album and you tell me. :D


Wah piang, owner can't tell, and dun expect me to tell using pics leh. [ass][be]:D

which pic is before, which after ?

[Chris Yew]

Myron you mean this one;
http://www.bettaclub.org.sg/photoalbum/Myron%20Tay/My%20Extended%20Red.jpg

[Chris Yew]

Myron you mean this one;
http://www.bettaclub.org.sg/photoalbum/Myron%20Tay/My%20Extended%20Red.jpg

[Myron Tay]

Yes. Thanks, Chris.

[Myron Tay]

Yes. Thanks, Chris.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Silas Khor


My bettas been having problems with broken rays. Initially I thought it could have been caused by pinholes. I have since revised my suspicions and think it must have been overflaring. I was warned not to let my juves flare for more than 5 mins per day, but sometimes when I'm washing and changing their water times seems to fly.
Presently, they are confined and not allowedto flare.
I would like to address the common causes of broken rays, whether it may be nutritional issues or overflaring, genetics etc.
Most importantly, the cure of this horrible condition would be most welcome!!
Some answers on this thread. Thanks.

[David Esguerra]

One thing to note though is that it is assumed in the previous posts (which I should note I have not read before since I wasn't a member of this forum at the time) that the fish only gets all that it needs from its diet. It should be acknowledged that fish could absorb certain minerals that they need from the water and this would be much more efficient than from feed because the nutrients need not pass through the digestive tract and the process of digestion.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by David Esguerra

this would be much more efficient than from feed because the nutrients need not pass through the digestive tract and the process of digestion.
David

This is an interesting statement. Let's take this on another thread.

[Silas Khor]

Thanks for reposting my queries, Myron. I found the previous posts very informative, especially with regards to diet and handling. Whilst I don't use a net I use my hands or those nylon scoop filters used for coffee/tea. My bettas main diet are frozen bloodworms, their previous diet was tubifex(I'm wondering if there's a problem here). I would like to add brine shrimp to their diet but locally frozen BS isn't a available. Hatching is too irregular or hassling.
To add further, I've been advised by KY Foong to use ketapang water with melafix. They have just been treated and I'll keep you all posted. The water is tinted yellowish brown with a coupla drops of melafix. They were previously in ketapang water (prev. owner), till I slowly eased them into getting used to blackwater extract. if this works I may be a convert to ketapang again.
Again, this could be the main cause, different water conditions.
Best to take them down one by one.

[Myron Tay]

Silas

I use a plastic container to scoop my bettas out from the tanks (together with enough water to hold the fish of course). In this way, there would be very little chance of damage caused by taking bettas out of their tanks.

[Silas Khor]

I'm currently using yellow powder(jap) to treat my bettas for broken rays and pinholes. I've tried nearly everything else, this is just further down the list. One thing I can definitely confirm, it improves the caudals by an impressive margin. The rays appear to be improving, though that could just be my hopeful eyes playing tricks on me. Will reconfirm soon.

[Martin]

Hi Myron :

Is Momizi tropical manufactures in Japan . Do you have thier URL add ??

Martin

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Martin

Hi Myron :

Is Momizi tropical manufactures in Japan . Do you have thier URL add ??

Martin
Yes, last I checked, I believe that Momizi is still manufactured in Japan, though I do not have the package right in front of me to check. Can anyone else confirm?

[Silas Khor]

I'm trying mineral water as a supplement for calcium.
So far the rays seem to be holding really well with yellow powder.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Silas Khor

I'm trying mineral water as a supplement for calcium.
So far the rays seem to be holding really well with yellow powder.
Silas

You have to note the following instructions on the packaging when using Japanese Yellow Powder: use 1-2 grams per 100 liters of water and then to remove the fish after 24 hours from the tank

[Silas Khor]

Whoops...okay, they've had enough yellow powder![xx(]
What do you think of adding a 1.5l bottle of mineral water to aged water with a content of 63mg of calcium? Anyone tried this?

[David Esguerra]

I didn't know mineral water had that much calcium, it may indeed help. However calcium may not be the only thing missing. I don't know if its the same with fish, but humans use calcium in conjunction with posphorous... I don't think that adding posphates would be healthy though, algae could use it but I don't think fish would really absorb it from the water, I even think that it is a regular part of what they excrete into the water. Still since you would dilute the mineral water in aged water anyway, I don't think the mineral water could cause too much harm.

[Silas Khor]

Thanks for your thoughts, David.
Furthermore, it's not the mere presence of calcium, but rather their ability to absorb it.
I wonder what types of foods acceptable to bettas contain these elements?

[David Esguerra]

You've got me thinking there. If we're talking of only live or frozen/freeze dried food, they're not really that rich in these elements (or for that matter, their useable form as elements are not always readily useable as they are i.e. iron in its rawest form could even be poisonous to fish but in a compound it is useful). The commercial food could help in this department, that's why variation is still the key.

[Silas Khor]

My eagerness to include calcium is pure speculation that a diet rich in calcium, or the mere presence in a bettas system could strengthen weak rays. While I'm wondering out loud, other suggestions are most welcome. Some background info :
My bettas were on a previous diet of live tubifex worms.
They were spawned and raised in ketapang water.
Presently they have been switched to frozen bloodworms, with the occasional betta dried food which they seem to loathe. I have tried ketapang water, however it seems to worsen the pinholes. When I refrained from mixing additives like ketapang and blackwater in their aged water, they seem much improved, more active, blowing nests etc. This formed the equation in my reasoning that water without any additives are higher in PH and therefore more alkaline, leading to the conclusion that there is a higher level of calcium in the water or the same level, but the alkalinity or some other element enables them to absorb it better.
Please feel free to correct this assumption, this is just logical reasoning, those who have more experience with water chemistry would be most welcome to comment.
However I agree with you David, a varied, well balanced diet is definitely a key element.
I'm attempting to take down the causes one by one, for the moment, water is my primary aim as they have been showing external symtoms such as pinholes and weak rays.
Myron, are reds harder to keep or is it just me? None of my other bettas have these problems, my blues NEVER encounter these problems, even with steadily deteriorating water conditions and just blood worms as a diet.
Not complaining, their frailty only pushes me to care more for them. I suspect that they have been inbred so much(reds in general) that their resistance is significantly lowered.

[Myron Tay]

Silas

Care should be taken to ensure that the addition of calcium does not create unnatural osmotic pressures as highlighted in the following thread: http://www.bettaclub.org.sg/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1775

As for your question to me, I have not kept any bettas other than reds and yellows, so I would not have a clue whether they are more problematic! But in my experience, it is almost impossible to maintain a show quality betta in show quality state unless you have bred him yourself. This is because there are so many parameters that a fish comes conditioned with that it is extremely difficult to replicate 100% by someone else other than his breeder!

[Silas Khor]

Thanks Myron, I feel a lot better. I'll be looking forward to the next generation then. I think the problem also was that I acquired them at a young age when growth pains were still in its process. I must have stressed them tremendously with the acclimatisation.

[David Esguerra]

Maybe so, do you still have contact with the person you got the fish from? A knowledge of the water where the fish were bred may help you know the real cause of your pin holes.

[Silas Khor]

Yes I do, and I know what the water conditions were like, the problem is I can't replicate them consistently. As far as I know the first one I acquired already had the pinholes.

[David Esguerra]

If it already had the pinholes, then as I said in our previous conversations, it could be genetic.

You said though that the pinholes in the other fish developed even under ketapang treatment? This is quite weird, bettas actually like hard but acidic water, at least in general.

Maybe it might indeed be the mineral/electrolyte balance of your water. I just heard an account from some other place that their water had absolutely no calcium, not even a milligram of calcium in the tap water. This can't be good, fish or human.

Of course I don't know about your water, however if you said that the pinholes seemed to heal when the water additives were removed, maybe that's just what you should do, stop adding additives. For all we know your water is already perfect the way it is without the additives.

[Silas Khor]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I'll keep you posted.

[Silas Khor]

I can't seem to shake the use of Aquaplus. I'm very cautious of chloramine. I really wish it could be zero additives.
Anyway, I was advised today by a breeder that the broken rays could be caused by overagression. He suggested that males should flare with other males for a controlled period of approx 5-10 mins. Males tend to flick their fins agressively when flaring against females, causing the rays to snap. These are isolated cases, I think. The main cause must be the water, and diet....Those are the two elements that strike me as being detrimental to the overall well being of our bettas.
Our house has recently been outfitted with a new water filter that supposedly produces "energy" water with a higher level of oxygen and all minerals intact, including calcium. We were previously drinking distilled water, which depleted our calcium intake. Anyway, this in relation to bettas.... I'm going to try the new water on a few specimens to see if there is any improvement. Their water came from the tap previously, not distilled so the calcium levels shouldn't be such a contrast. In addition to this, instead of daily 100% water changes, I shall perform daily 25% water changes.

[Silas Khor]

I can't seem to shake the use of Aquaplus. I'm very cautious of chloramine. I really wish it could be zero additives.
Anyway, I was advised today by a breeder that the broken rays could be caused by overagression. He suggested that males should flare with other males for a controlled period of approx 5-10 mins. Males tend to flick their fins agressively when flaring against females, causing the rays to snap. These are isolated cases, I think. The main cause must be the water, and diet....Those are the two elements that strike me as being detrimental to the overall well being of our bettas.
Our house has recently been outfitted with a new water filter that supposedly produces "energy" water with a higher level of oxygen and all minerals intact, including calcium. We were previously drinking distilled water, which depleted our calcium intake. Anyway, this in relation to bettas.... I'm going to try the new water on a few specimens to see if there is any improvement. Their water came from the tap previously, not distilled so the calcium levels shouldn't be such a contrast. In addition to this, instead of daily 100% water changes, I shall perform daily 25% water changes.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Silas Khor

I can't seem to shake the use of Aquaplus. I'm very cautious of chloramine. I really wish it could be zero additives.
Anyway, I was advised today by a breeder that the broken rays could be caused by overagression. He suggested that males should flare with other males for a controlled period of approx 5-10 mins. Males tend to flick their fins agressively when flaring against females, causing the rays to snap. These are isolated cases, I think. The main cause must be the water, and diet....Those are the two elements that strike me as being detrimental to the overall well being of our bettas.
Silas

I disagree with the assessment of the breeder because I flare my bettas at least 30 mins each day and I do not get snapped caudals. The reason I let them go at each other for so long is that that is the only form of exercise that they get daily! Just like humans, exercise for bettas is healthy and should be encouraged.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Silas Khor

I can't seem to shake the use of Aquaplus. I'm very cautious of chloramine. I really wish it could be zero additives.
Anyway, I was advised today by a breeder that the broken rays could be caused by overagression. He suggested that males should flare with other males for a controlled period of approx 5-10 mins. Males tend to flick their fins agressively when flaring against females, causing the rays to snap. These are isolated cases, I think. The main cause must be the water, and diet....Those are the two elements that strike me as being detrimental to the overall well being of our bettas.
Silas

I disagree with the assessment of the breeder because I flare my bettas at least 30 mins each day and I do not get snapped caudals. The reason I let them go at each other for so long is that that is the only form of exercise that they get daily! Just like humans, exercise for bettas is healthy and should be encouraged.

[Silas Khor]

I agree that flaring is essential as exercise Myron, but I think it's more in terms or expanding their caudal spread. Swimming and moving alone is exercise, flaring in itself is a sign of agression against threats to territory and a mating signal.
But back to the said breeders assesment, he was advising against flaring for certain specimens(isolated cases, to quote my earlier post), those who already display an overagressive nature. In my case, I should have specified earlier, this particular betta is young and as such I do not want to stress him further as the change in water conditions and environment are affecting him as it is. As you mentioned earlier, it is difficult to raise a show quality betta unless it is from your own spawn.
I am being extra careful with the water changes this time round, to avoid the earlier complications.

[Silas Khor]

I agree that flaring is essential as exercise Myron, but I think it's more in terms or expanding their caudal spread. Swimming and moving alone is exercise, flaring in itself is a sign of agression against threats to territory and a mating signal.
But back to the said breeders assesment, he was advising against flaring for certain specimens(isolated cases, to quote my earlier post), those who already display an overagressive nature. In my case, I should have specified earlier, this particular betta is young and as such I do not want to stress him further as the change in water conditions and environment are affecting him as it is. As you mentioned earlier, it is difficult to raise a show quality betta unless it is from your own spawn.
I am being extra careful with the water changes this time round, to avoid the earlier complications.

[Silas Khor]

I've finally concluded that broken-rays in the case of my bettas are caused by being away from the originals breeders environment.
They can't be fixed or cured, no amount of calcium additives will aid this condition, the only remedy would be exact replication of the water they came from. Impossible.
I'm glad at least that it isn't genetics, though this is isolated to my case...It can be linked generally.

[Silas Khor]

I've finally concluded that broken-rays in the case of my bettas are caused by being away from the originals breeders environment.
They can't be fixed or cured, no amount of calcium additives will aid this condition, the only remedy would be exact replication of the water they came from. Impossible.
I'm glad at least that it isn't genetics, though this is isolated to my case...It can be linked generally.

[Myron Tay]

Goes to show that if you want to have fantastic fish that you can be proud of, you need to breed them yourself or get someone who lives near you to do it for you.

[Myron Tay]

Goes to show that if you want to have fantastic fish that you can be proud of, you need to breed them yourself or get someone who lives near you to do it for you.

[Alex Lim]

Silas,

just had a broken rays case like you. the reason? let the fella flare at his prospective wife for more than three days without carding. the exams have hit me real hard this time.. [bt]

[Alex Lim]

Silas,

just had a broken rays case like you. the reason? let the fella flare at his prospective wife for more than three days without carding. the exams have hit me real hard this time.. [bt]

[Michael Koh]

Hi everyone,

Well I happen to have a nice red with broken caudal rays too !!:(
Can anyone please tell me whether the rays will heal back with time or it's going to be permanently broken. It's about 2 1/2 months old and still young so I guess it's going to heal.;)
Hope you guys can provide me with some good news !! [tx]

[Michael Koh]

Hi everyone,

Well I happen to have a nice red with broken caudal rays too !!:(
Can anyone please tell me whether the rays will heal back with time or it's going to be permanently broken. It's about 2 1/2 months old and still young so I guess it's going to heal.;)
Hope you guys can provide me with some good news !! [tx]

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Michael Koh

Hi everyone,

Well I happen to have a nice red with broken caudal rays too !!:(
Can anyone please tell me whether the rays will heal back with time or it's going to be permanently broken. It's about 2 1/2 months old and still young so I guess it's going to heal.;)
Hope you guys can provide me with some good news !! [tx]
Unfortunately, I do not have good news for your Michael. In my experience, the broken rays do heal, especially on a young fish, but they are never as good as they were before. The only solution I have found is to look for better fish in the next generation. Michael, have you considered betta breeding? :D

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by Michael Koh

Hi everyone,

Well I happen to have a nice red with broken caudal rays too !!:(
Can anyone please tell me whether the rays will heal back with time or it's going to be permanently broken. It's about 2 1/2 months old and still young so I guess it's going to heal.;)
Hope you guys can provide me with some good news !! [tx]
Unfortunately, I do not have good news for your Michael. In my experience, the broken rays do heal, especially on a young fish, but they are never as good as they were before. The only solution I have found is to look for better fish in the next generation. Michael, have you considered betta breeding? :D

[Michael Koh]

Hi Myron,

Thanks for the ..."bad" news !!

There's still a glimmer of hope since you say they do heal on a young fish even thou they might not be as perfect:)

As for betta breeding Myron, yes, I do enjoy the idea of breeding my bettas but it is solely for fun and pleasures of it since I'm a newbie !! In fact, only 8 fries survived from the 1st spawning !:(
Guess I have to get some tips from you and all the guys here !!:) Actually I got a lot of tips already from this forum alone. thanks !!

[Michael Koh]

Hi Myron,

Thanks for the ..."bad" news !!

There's still a glimmer of hope since you say they do heal on a young fish even thou they might not be as perfect:)

As for betta breeding Myron, yes, I do enjoy the idea of breeding my bettas but it is solely for fun and pleasures of it since I'm a newbie !! In fact, only 8 fries survived from the 1st spawning !:(
Guess I have to get some tips from you and all the guys here !!:) Actually I got a lot of tips already from this forum alone. thanks !!

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by sylwester

I have a spawn that seems to have bent dorsals in my HM-line and I haven't cared about calcium at all. In Norway, the hardness of the water is like 0-1dh and I wondered if it may be lack of calcium that may have caused it?

I have read threads about this problem in CT's and know that it may be caused by PH-iregularities too..
Sylwester

Let's take this discussion to this thread.

[Myron Tay]

quote:Originally posted by sylwester

I have a spawn that seems to have bent dorsals in my HM-line and I haven't cared about calcium at all. In Norway, the hardness of the water is like 0-1dh and I wondered if it may be lack of calcium that may have caused it?

I have read threads about this problem in CT's and know that it may be caused by PH-iregularities too..
Sylwester

Let's take this discussion to this thread.